Help! Quick advice needed on 2003 Jazz CVT shudder

Hi - just discovered this forum.

I have 2003 model and have read some of the CVT shudder threads (can't find them now). If you don't mind I'd appreciate some advice as to how to get this resolved.

I have 5 yr warranty which expires July - the car is going in today. I have complained about the shudder at a few services, looking back through the docs, they have changed to the new CVT oil last year. It still shudders. Whatever they do seems to fix it for a while, but then it starts again.

The car has a little over 60k - this has been going on forever it seems and it seems to me after reading the threads the CVT is shot. It could be the starter clutch thing - I reckon that's what they'll suggest when I take it in today. But I don't want to be in the position of that fixing it for a while, then when the warranty runs out in July, having the shudder back. This has been going on so long I reckon the CVT has had it.

Opinions?

TIA.

Go Here http://www.ausjazz.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1857

its a common problem.

Get them to put in writing that the problem was identified during the warranty period and that if the CVT fails, they will cover it under goodwill warranty for a period of X years after warranty. Not easy, but if you can get this letter, you will have peace of mind. Even a little persuasion like saying how you will continue to bring your car to that dealer for servicing because you like the level of service that provided and all that can go a long way.

Thanks. Battery was dead when I went to drop it off - 2nd time this week so up for a new battery even though it's only just over a year old.

Told them what was going wrong (smelly, rattly noise when cruising, noisy and unresolved shudder that I now know is a common problem with the CVT and I wasn't going to accept an oil change as a resolution).

When I collected it they said they changed the oil, but I wasn't being charged for it (?! I said it had already had the new CVT oil, which they charged me for, last service and it wasn't the answer) and see if that helps. Not what I wanted to hear. The mechanic came out towards the end of going through other stuff that needed sorting (they hadn't kept the service book up to date and didn't have record of extended warranty) and said if it doesn't fix it, they'll just have to order clutch starter. I said and what if that fails after the warranty expires, when this has been going on the whole 5 yrs I've had the car - he said it will come with 12 mths but after that he didn't know. He mentioned that loads of Jazzes are driving around with the shudders - I said I didn't want to, not when I've been complaining about it all along.

So....tappets need tightening as well. I have to bring it in overnight for that. They suggested some anti bacteria thing for the a/c/smell. I'm a bit dubious about that as I'm extremely sensitive to perfumes/fragrances. Driving off and the shudder is just as bad, if not worse, the car sounds like a heap of shite, tapping noises and roaring.

I'm not a happy bunny. This has really turned me off Honda, yet I'd always felt they had really good customer service. They've been ripping me off all along. I never thought a 5 yr old car with 60k would feel like such a heap. Especially a Honda.

I'll ring tommorrow and book it in for the tappets and a new starter clutch thing. I think I want to trade it in on something with airbags - maybe Yaris. But the other half says no way.

Dammit!

Yeah I had a noisy shudder problem with my Jazz too, but it's automatic, not manual. I thought I just had a really loose hatch window. I called up Honda servicing and the guy told me it's probably just my number plate rattling. All I got to do is put a sponge between the number plate and my car. But I removed the black border on the number plate instead (i.e. the advertisement for the dealership you bought the Jazz from. For me it was Colin's Honda - Rockdale). Problem solved. The guys at servicing probably aren't allowed to tell you to remove their "advertising" so they suggest using a sponge.

Mines an auto. The shudder isn't anything like a rattle though - you'd know it if you had it. The whole car vibrates when accelarating from stationary. It feels like I'm driving ride-on lawnmower that's been serviced by the Teletubbies.

yes the shudder is a common fault. generally if the cvtf flush doesnt work it either gets a new start clutch or in some cases a new trans. honda evaluate this on a case by case basis.
also can i note be POLITE yet persistent asbeing rude/abrasive will get you nowhere, even if you are in the right. (not saying you have been rude but it happens all the time)

also why do you need your tappets done, and why is that an overnight thing?
the tappets should have been done at approx 40k so shouldn't be due again til about 80k :confused:

with the aircon there is not much they can do other than offer an antibacterial treatment and inspect all the drainage points. there is generally very little that goes wrong with aircon these days

also if your battery has died recently get them to carry out the cvt memory relearning procedure (ignore if they end up repairing it coz they will do anyway)

don't feel too disheartened with the trans problem, honda in general are very good with common faults like that. i have seen 9-10yo cars (mainly hrv) get brand new cvts at no charge, all covered by 'goodwill' by honda

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Originally Posted by aaronng

Get them to put in writing that the problem was identified during the warranty period and that if the CVT fails, they will cover it under goodwill warranty for a period of X years after warranty.

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lol @ getting something like that in writing :wave:

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Originally Posted by MDJase

Yeah I had a noisy shudder problem with my Jazz too, but it's automatic, not manual. I thought I just had a really loose hatch window. I called up Honda servicing and the guy told me it's probably just my number plate rattling. All I got to do is put a sponge between the number plate and my car. But I removed the black border on the number plate instead (i.e. the advertisement for the dealership you bought the Jazz from. For me it was Colin's Honda - Rockdale). Problem solved. The guys at servicing probably aren't allowed to tell you to remove their "advertising" so they suggest using a sponge.

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jazz number plate rattles are common. dealers usually stick like a foam padding being the plate, there is no need to remove the number plate protector (at least with the time most melb dealers use)

protector? what's it protecting?

the number plate, hence me labelling it a 'number plate protector'

however ur dealer by the sounds of it used a cheap 'frame' rather than the ones that cover the whole plate

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Originally Posted by panda[cRx]

be POLITE yet persistent asbeing rude/abrasive will get you nowhere, even if you are in the right. (not saying you have been rude but it happens all the time)

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Yes - doing my best on this note. They're on the back foot a bit because while I was there we worked out that a)they hadn't kept my book up to date (we fixed it while I was there) b) they charged me for CVT oil and flush last service which was covered by warranty and c) there is records of me complaining about the shudder. It just annoys me because he would have known the flush he did today didn't fix the shudder, yet they left me with the job of having to tell them yet again the shudder problem is still there. With the amount of reporting of the shudder I have done, combined with their knowledge that it was a common CVT problem, and my saying at the outset that I would not see an oil change as a resolution today - it feels like I'm being fobbed off. This is why customers go into attack mode - they feel as if they have to ramp it up to get heard. Is it any wonder?

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also why do you need your tappets done, and why is that an overnight thing?
the tappets should have been done at approx 40k so shouldn't be due again til about 80k :confused:

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Well I'm SO not a mechanic- but the problem I was talking about didn't sound like a tappet problem to me. I do know what tappets sound like (had an old are many years ago with probs) So when they said that the noise was tappets......what can I say? But.....when I drove it out, it sounds like it's got damn tappet problems now. They said it's an overnight thing because it has to be done when the car is really cold and it needs to be driven in and left to cool down and usually that means overnight. Does that sound right or a load of cobblers? It's not a problem for me to leave it overnight. Well, not much of one anyway - that's the least of my worries.

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don't feel too disheartened with the trans problem, honda in general are very good with common faults like that. i have seen 9-10yo cars (mainly hrv) get brand new cvts at no charge, all covered by 'goodwill' by honda

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Wow - really? Out of warranty for 7 yrs and a transmission replacement? That is heartening!

So - what's the advice for when I ring tommorrow? Say please can I have a starter clutch replacement. Or ask for the transmission replacement? What do I say if they say I have to let it run for a bit to see if the oil change gets rid of it? I can't believe they sent me off with it still shuddering saying 'see if that works' - after the history.

Thanks.

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Originally Posted by jazzychick

So - what's the advice for when I ring tommorrow? Say please can I have a starter clutch replacement. Or ask for the transmission replacement? What do I say if they say I have to let it run for a bit to see if the oil change gets rid of it? I can't believe they sent me off with it still shuddering saying 'see if that works' - after the history.

Thanks.

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i'd prolly just be straight up with them, mention you know its a common problem and you would (obviously) like it resolved asap.

demand (nicely) that they submit a 'pwa' to honda to request authorisation for repairs under warranty (if it is indeed in extended warranty)

if it is out of warranty they can still request for assitance from honda australia as its a common fault. as i said earlier this kind of stuff is all reviewed on a case by case basis. if you are unhappy with the results ask your dealer for the number to honda customer relations and see how you go



as for tappets most workshops use air conditioner type units to cool down the engines. so while it CAN be left overnight so they can be done first thing in the morning its not a necessity

i found out that the rattling or small squeeky noise from the front of my dash was actually the retractor flap from the boot...

:P