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Originally Posted by vupham
the civic sport will still sell very well. Why? coz its auto i have had 6 people ask me if the CTR comes in auto already! The sport is still a different market. Its still good value for money with the sunroof and leather ect and only in the mid 30k bracket. Just like the fucus luxury and mazda 3 SP23 will still sell well.
its a type R, not a type S, its the UK type R! Honda will never go back to raw designs of the DC2R, as people these days prefer comfort and handling and all the little luxuries.Quote:
Originally Posted by vupham
thats so true!
the thing that makes me laugh is all these people wanting the 'true' type R, even though there is no market for it now and times have changed...
also how many of the people who say all this actually bought it new when it came out???
or how many are actually in the market for a new CTR???
or how many bought a new car in the last 2 years...???
Alot of us have i know but the ones with the 6 year old hondas and the ones that have no intention on buying a new car in the near future that whinge all the time about honda new car make me laugh.
Well buddy you are laughing at me. I want a freakin' true Type R and I'm prepared to pay for it.
The market has changed, but there are plenty of die-hard DC2R owners such as myself, who WOULD buy a new Type R if it were a cracking drive. Instead we are left to look to Evo's, elise's, mx5's etc's if we want to try and `raise the bar' while keeping a pure driving experience. But none have a glorious NA honda engine and gearbox.
I'm thinking about getting an EP3 import, it's more a Type R spirit over this one, but the problem is that it's no newer than my DC2R for the same money.
If the 4 door CTR came out here I would buy it.
Please Honda, make me a car that I'd want to buy and I'll gladly pay you for it. But don't try and sell me some half baked Type R and tell me that that is what I want...who told you that? the same marketing people that tell you there is no longer a market for enthusiasts who are fans of the purity and execution of even 6 year old DC2Rs?Quote:
Originally Posted by UNLS1
Well, if it was a choice between the Japanese car, and the UK car, I'll vote with my wallet for the former. Is the Japanese demographic so different to the Australian that our market is deemed not feasible for Honda Aus to sell the version the Japanese actually consider worthy of the Type R badge in their local market? If that is the case, then that is a sad indictment on the Australian buying public, if we had the opportunity to pursue a technically better product but settle for gloss and spin then I'd say that there are a lot of ppl that are blissfully happy being ignorant of what Honda are truly capable of in building magnificent driver's cars that punch well above their weight.
"Type R" SHOULD be a no brainer for any self respecting enthusiast (much like when Porsche deems something worthy enough of wearing the "RS" badge..you know it is going to be one where the engineers have won most of the product design arguments), but given the cynicism towards this new car, it saddens me that the use of Type R brand is not applied with the sort of discipline that Porsche applies to its ultimate models. When we start bastardising the brand, you lose the share of mind that people like me hold about the maker and this can only be a bad thing. More so, when Honda is spending $$$ in motorsport to create a sporting and exciting brand. I can tell you, when I think of the "power of my dreams", this UK CTR doesn't even register.
By the way, I have the means to purchase any new car Honda currently offers, but just not the desire.
Signed,
one of those whingers.
Slipangle, Porsche is almost purely a marque of sports performance cars, of which Honda is definately not, so I find it difficult to grasp that you try and compare a 'Type R' to an 'RS' .
Has everyone also forgotten that the 'mighty' JDM CTR is able to generate its far 'superior' power due to 100 RON fuel being readily available in Japan. Last time I checked, 100 RON fuel was fairly hard to come by in Australia (although I will apologise if it is now available in mainland Aus as I know it isn't available in Tasmania). Thus, surely if the JDM CTR was imported to Australia then it would have to be 'de-tuned' anyway to cope with our fuel. If that was the case it then should be re-badged a Type S shouldn't it???
The JDM CTR also has options such as Sat Nav, Climate Control and Bluetooth phone capabilities just to name a few, now to a true Honda purist these are definately not befitting of a 'Type R'????
The JDM CTR is also a four door sedan, all other CTR's have been 2 door hatches have they not?? Now to a true Honda purist this is surely not acceptable...
Some of us are just tired of the teenage keyboard racers that in reality cannot afford any brand new CTR regardless of origin, but choose to constantly undermine the UK CTR in favour of a four door sedan with a massive wing that Australia will never see. UNLS1 is right, the market has changed, the majority of people that can actually afford a CTR want more than a stripped out race car. So why would Honda release a stripped out race car that will not sell as new, but will be a highly sought after used car when it becomes affordable for the 20-30 year old male age bracket?
Has Australia ever been delivered a 'true Type R'?? DC2R? DC5R? not true JDM spec. Stop complaining and ust enjoy what we have......
i agree, there are only a handful of you guys who want the raw type R, but honda australia doesnt see that as viable business option to satisfy putting in the costs to bring it over here, if you look back at the DC2R, DC5R, prelude and type S yes they did sell but they didnt sell enough to justify keeping it, as the market segment has a broader spectrum and they know that market change, you need to keep up with the demands...
We all know that hondas racing background gave Honda the slap in the head to at least bring something over that can meet the 'large consumer market of australia' and the UK type R was what they considered to match the Golf, Focus etc...so whoever buys this UK built type R tell us how it is and show us some pictures of it!
Wazza, you are missing the point we are making. In our view, a Type R should not have "Sat Nav, Climate Control and Bluetooth phone capabilities". A Type R should be focused on driving, on purity. A Type S should have those luxury features.
A Type R in the 90's equated to an Porsche RS because they are both types of cars focussed on driver feedback, involvement and purity. The EVO reader Top Ten had both the DC2R and NSX Type R alongside the Porsche GT3. Sure the Honda's are slower, but they are as focussed.
Regarding RON, that is not a real reason, the fact is Honda Japan don't want us to have those cars for whatever reason. The 2006 DC5 Type S had a 154 kw, 6kw more than this CTR???
It's not about 2 or 4 doors, it's about purity and focus. Honda set amazing benchmarks in the first CTR, the DC2R and NSXR. We all looked forward to the next versions, and we did not get what we were expecting with this AUDM CTR.
Let me reiterate, most DC2R owners I know do not want to buy new a CTR. We have to go elsewhere.
A car that is heavier, has no advancement in power, no LSD and is full of luxury options - this is not a stripped out race model which is the Type R heritage.
That was in the 90's. Everyone was doing stripped-down fast cars. It is now 2007 and everyone wants power, handling, comforts, CD stackers and bluetooth.Quote:
Originally Posted by mpd076-chuck
Because the Type S makes peak torque at 7000rpm. I don't think you want an engine with no low rpm torque. JDM Type Rs make more torque at a similar RPM. So they have different ECU mapping, probably for their 100 RON fuel.Quote:
Originally Posted by mpd076-chuck
There is also a type R PLUS available in overseas markets.Lighter weight,better handling.Not sure on extra power though.
If any one here has a chance to look in the trpe R workshop manual supplement it is mentioned VERY breifly.
They probably planned to build something like that but decided not to. I don't see a Type R Plus for sale on the Honda UK site.Quote:
Originally Posted by spanks