Actually, i post up the same thread in ftoaustralia.com, but there's not much response over there! It's much more alive over here!
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Actually, i post up the same thread in ftoaustralia.com, but there's not much response over there! It's much more alive over here!
R Type FTOs are very quick. I have competed in sprints at Winton with a guy with a stock FTO R type against my stock Integra DC2R we are neck and neck (we were both around 1:47’s-1:48’s).When we both went from road tyres to track tyres (otherwise stock) we were both very close (1:45’s). His driving has improved a bit and he has started modifying his car – he is now in the 1:42’s. My car has done a 1:43.9 (with a very good driver behind the wheel) so I have a bit further to go with my skills.
At the end of one of the Winton sprints they had a “muck up” session where the cars that are on the track go all out for 10 to 15 laps. I was out with the FTO – we were both on our road tyres and 2 car lengths apart. With both of us trying flat out there was no difference in braking, acceleration or cornering. We were so close and evenly matched it wasn’t funny.
Unless you have raced against a well driven FTO on a track you wouldn’t believe how well they go. Street “racing” is no comparison.
I guess that was unbias comment to considering you own a type R. Ok since you know how the both handle and the differences, in the end what car would you pick. Although you do own a Type R which kinda answers my question.
Well, I was after a car that handled well on a race track, that was new (warranty) and that was naturally aspirated (so that I wouldn't be tempted to up the boost and so that I could insure it). I also came out of a 91 CRX and the DC2 was a variation of the CRX chassis. My CRX was great on a track.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sp3rMz
All of this steered me towards the DC2R.
hey dont get me wrong... i have respect for other cars... fto isnt a bad car by all means...
but mitsubishi could've done so much more if they wanted to
Do you know if it's a manual R type FTO or Tiptronic?? Because i know the Tiptronic version of Type R FTO is a 5 speed tiptronic! With 5 speed tiptronic, i wonder if it's as fast as the manual version!
Quote:
Originally Posted by smudge
Manual versions of the FTO are faster than the Tiptronic versionsQuote:
Originally Posted by kenshin
Yeah i guess they could of, if anything they would put a 6a12 Non Mivec turbo which produced 149kws.... only two more kws than the 6a12 Mivec 147kw :confused:
They could of also put the 6a13 tt which is the 2.5 lt twin turbo... but i think that would of made the FTO too nose heavy, thus negating the light NA ff Feel... :confused:
sperm, why are you being so critical about ppl going off topic?
I mean ppl join this forum to chat, debate and have fun........ i trhink you're spoilling it by being so strict.
I think that attitude will lose members. Lucky i'm not so peeved off by your rules but i guess some others might be. Sorry if i offended you. Just lettin you know what i feel.
BTW, arn't i so sexy in my sunnies :P
gpr is that fast is it????
hmmz....well since its a V6 2.0 litre =)
you would expect it to be much quicker...
compared to a 4 cyliner 1.8l right? =P
now lets compare performance Vs fuel Efficiency! =P
The Teg will win easily =P
ive driven a 2 gpx's and they actually do go alright..
ive raced many FTO's straight line..... and they fall behind pretty easily...
fuel efficiency wise...
mine runs about 560kms on about 50 litres.
so its not bad :o
Da1nONLY, how much would u expect from a 2lt v6?
My "MODED" Type R running "RICH" and needs a "RETUNE" is running 350km full tank 50 litres. :(
BTW - Slightly heavy footed too. Just slightly.
Hey guys,
I am an FTO owner - I have the GP Version R model with a 5spd manual box.
Personally I believe (without having driven a DC2R) that the two cars would be very similarly matched, but that the Honda would have the slight advantage. The trouble is is that it comes down to so many other things, such as driver, road, conditions, etc that it would be very hard to measure, although I found the above post re the Winton race comparison very interesting. It just seems to me that the DC2R has a harder edge which would give it the nod. But then again, a DC2R here would be worth $5-10k more than my car.
Regarding the FTO GPvR, they have the same spec as a standard GPX Mivec FTO, with the same power output. However they have in addition a helical LSD diff, front and rear tower strut braces, and a larger rear wing. The seats are the same as the GPX, but are trimmed in different colours (mine are bright blue). The GPvR weighs slightly less (but not much) than a GPX due to being stripped of some sound deadening and having manual air con. They also don't have traction control or mirror retracting motors. They are available in both 5spd manual and 5spd tiptronic auto. Hope that clears that up.
Regarding fuel efficiency - I get about 500km from a 50L tank of 96 octane.
As far as I can tell, the standard 1/4 mile for a FTO GPvR manual is 14.8.
I am a former Honda owner - I used to have a Prelude and a DA6 VTEC Integra. And I went for a ride in a Jap spec DC5 Type R the other day and daaaammn was that awesome! But I'll go back to the Mitsi forums now ... ;)
Type R N FTO same!!!! as long as you guys dont try to compare One of Honda's finest cars against some stupid new Commodore or Falcon I'm Happy (Sarcasm like fully 100%) :D
Firstly, the ITR and the FTO are in the top 5 produced FF cars for handling.
I like [afterburner]'s responce especially for his honesty an unbias opinion.
Now i can compare these two cars but with my ride.
After having a dyno comp - one car after another:
Dyno~
Civic: JDM ITR everything 149.5HP@wheels
FTO GPX: custom CAI and exhaust 149.1HP@wheels
Strip~
Civic: consistant 14.2 - 14.4
FTO: 14.8 to 15.1
I dont consider myself a better driver, but i know the Hondas drivetrain/gearing is better than the FTO. Not to mention the weight advantage.
:)
yup deffinately,
the type r has better gearing.. Fto has such a long 2nd and 3rd gear , at that point a type r starts gaining on the Fto.
Well put adam, id put the difference in drag times down to a lack of an LSD in the GPX (only the GPR's have them), and maybe your weight stripping ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Civic Type R
We are merely adhering to the forums' T&C.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bludger
Want to chat? Chat about the topic. Otherwise, in the lounge.
Want to debate? Do so according to the topic. Othwerwise, start another topic.
Want to have fun? Log off and go lay on the grass in the park and breath some fresh air. :)
This is not personal Bludger, just explaining it to every curious minds.
:)
Back on topic
The R version of the FTO is limited correct?
But the GPx version is the more common top range FTO available in Australia, correct?
Me driven an FTO before too , jus don feel the kick i get with the DC2r in corners...
FTOs are too nose heavy - not nearly as quick as a DC2R and don't drive as nice
FTO's are supposed to be right next to Type R handling (not as good, but right next to them)
Type R is lighter so it might be quicker in a straight line.
In the end of the day I think a Type R is quicker anyway you look at it but not by a huge amount.
BUT, the FTO interior is MUCH nicer (minus Recaro seats) than a Type R, and the V6 is smooth, and the suspension is more comfortable, and it does have climate control, and that engine sound... and it revs so easily and blah blah
I think it just depends, if you want full out "track car" get Type R, but if you want something a bit slower but with creature comforts, get an FTO.
I wouldnt have thought a FTO could come close to a dc2R in handling...
If they do though......new found respect for them.. :)
The Version R is a Type competitor.
Over the normal GPX MIVEC model it comes with braces, stiffer springs/dampers/swaybars, Ralliart LSD, and weight reducted.
They are said to be the 2nd best handling FWD car, right after the Type R. It won Japanese car of the year in 94 when it was released, which was the 2nd time ever for a sports car to win that trophy.
Though don't worry, in Oz mostly you get auto's, some MIVEC some not. And VERY rarely if ever will you see the Version R.
Between the GPvR and TypeR there is nothing in it. It comes down to the driver.
With the money you save on a FTO, even a GPX, you could do it up to go faster and handle better than TypeR, yes you can get aftermarket LSD. Not only that, the FTO has much more comfortable seats for daily driving but enough support for racing. I guess the looks are subjective, but let the public speak for that, I see more people turn their heads for an FTO than an Integra.
Below is what I wrote in the FTOAustralia forum. But I think you guys are on the right track now...
------------------------------
I know this is a comparison between the FTO and Integra, in their entire model range right?
ie.
FTO (GS, GR, GP, GPX, GPvR etc.)
Integra (GSi, VTiR, TypeR etc.)
Maybe the comparison should be TypeR vs GPvR (this is really what we are interested in aren't we?)
The biased people from ozhonda seem to misunderstand the comparison and are actually comapring TypeR to any FTO, not considering that there are at least 5 in the model range (with different engines) and that there are 4/5 speed auto transmissions as well. All up against the manual only TypeR which was race bred from the beginning. FTOs in general are more geared towards being a livable fun-to-drive street car. Mitsubishi's answer to the TypeR was the FTO GPvR.
Of course it is most likely for a TypeR owner to go up against an FTO on the streets and it could quite possibly be a GR, or very likely to be a GPX auto, and they will draw the conclusion that their TypeR is superior to an FTO (hey they are human after all).
So conversely, a Manual GPvR owner can rightly go up against a Integra GSi, or even a VTiR and blow it off the streets, and conclude that FTOs are better than Integras. But they won't do this, coz they know about the TypeR.
The difference here is that most Honda owners, actually the general population don't know much about FTOs and the model line-up/transmission choices.
Someone should point this out to OzHonda... or maybe I will cut and paste this there :)
LOL, but there left standing there wondering WTF that ugly POS was that just passed them....Quote:
Originally Posted by G-1
oh, i guess from your point of view you like to look twice at ugly things.
as for me, i prefer not to... it's all subjective like i said :cool:
and you admitted before that it does LOOK good/fast, now you changed to ugly POS :pQuote:
Originally Posted by IRI
Just stirring up the rivalry s'all:cool:
Honestly i dont mind the looks of FTO, i think one of the most unique and original designs around... but still prefer the teg;)
a year or so back, i saw it on a performance DVD with these two particular cars on a straight line. stock V stock with two professional drivers on the hand
the fto was side by side till around the 90km mark and after that, the type r just took off. the end result was 2 car lenghts or so
in terms of performance on the straight line, i dont think theres two much in between the two. although it doesnt give a definite answer to which is better of the two, one things for sure the straight line race was settled.
it's all good, they are both nice cars and i feel that people give FTO too much flak without knowing much about em.... i woulda got a TypeR instead of the FTO but the seats were too uncomfortable for me, and werent CD/aircon options? Im talking about DC2.
FTO - better package for daily driver who wants to have fun (and can be tuned with the money you save)
Integra TypeR - better for the hard-edged driver (out-of-the-box) who doesn't mind some discomfort for a more involving drive.
FTO GPvR - goes head to head with TypeR, but are very rare
No doubt that the TypeR has achieved what it was built for, and as long as that's what you're looking for in a car, then you should be very happy with it.
Well that one race result was settled.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blew_lude
And you are sure it was a FTO GPvR? and not a FTO GPX?
my friend has a GPX he lives across the road from me his mivec screams!! cant wait till i get my honda an run him down the creek :)
but il say a fto will give the dc2/5 a good run..!!
G1- no, im not sure.
im only assuming it is
it just says, Type r Vs FTO on the heading..imnot japanese so obviously i couldnt understand the words he was saying
yes it was one race, but one race that was equal
i've sat in a FTO (4sp tip) and a type r with pod (damn my gsi...sigh...).
comments.
type R > FTO in terms of ride. damn the type R is such a fun ride
FTO > type R in terms in comfort interior and looks
damn the FTO is such a nice looking car..too bad its a mitsu badge...
it reminds me of the rx8 that car...
hmm..get a FTO and put a mazda badge on it...
hmm....
Dont forget guys if your comparing the ITR to the FTO you should all be refering to the ITR equivelant in the FTO range.
The FTO type r is what you should be refering to. The bonuses it gets is a LSD, upgraded shocks, a bit of weight reduction and slightly different bodykit and bigger rear spoiler.
Compare those two together and id pick the FTO to be just as quick in a circuit battle and drag race.
Lets just say "Type R's better in every single way!!" why?.. because its a HONDA! n theyre built to perfection!.. thats all dats left to be sed lolz..
thank you thats the point ive been making since i joined this discussion.Quote:
Originally Posted by STOCK
dont forget that FTO GPvR also comes with front and rear strut towers as standard, which the other FTOs don't get. + LSD + suspension + weight reduction.
driven my mates FTO and while they are an ok car in my opinion they have nothing on the R. i'm not a fan of the factory clutch too
read the above post you are a bit behindQuote:
Originally Posted by panda[CRX]
at the end of the day honda's vtec the real variable valve timing...
BMI did a race with dc2r wrx sti coupe ek9 FTO GP VErsion R and AE111s
the WRX won the dc2r by like 1 car length on the last straight
FTO GPR beat ek9 by like a car
and the ae 111s were way too slow
just an examplle of the handling of dc2r on track
and also my frends del sol beat a GPR
and also the guys whjo have sed they never heard of the handling capabilities of the 306 S16
where have u guys been ?????
the 306 is the first FF to have 6 spd gearbox
and it also has dual stage intake manifold
they are pretti hard
mags inlcuding Car & driver have dun comparisons with the DC2R
and the handling scores are pretti close even tho the dc2r comes out the winner
my 2c
one of few reasonable posts so far... that del sol musta been modedQuote:
BMI did a race with dc2r wrx sti coupe ek9 FTO GP VErsion R and AE111s
and is there a way you can share that BMI vid, i'd love to see it.
Type R might edge out the GPvR if driven by a professional driver, and if i had it as a second car for track i'd be very happy with the type R. but for daily public road use, youre not gonna notice the difference and FTO range in general has nicer interior and creature comforts for less money.
ok noise factor... inside the FTO would be more quieter...Quote:
Originally Posted by G-1
good or bad ... ppl want different things...
but come on... saying the interior of a FTO is better than a DC2 Type R?? recaro's alum gear knob carbon fibre like panels... ummm whats the FTO got?... round gauges... and bucket seats which feel like normal seats... bah... bland
rear seats are more comfy in an integra too...
well typeR has a race oriented interior, pretty plain apart from the recaro seats and gear knob. the gpvr has embroidered coloured bucket seats which are more comfortable for daily driving and still has enough support. apart from that i think the FTO has a unique interior (like the racey centre gauges and unique door trim/design, and centre console which is angled towards the driver, and funky looking climate control on the GPX, not to mention an armrest/storage compartment for the front passengers) as opposed to a very generic Honda layout in the Integra.Quote:
Originally Posted by kenshin
well i think we need an unbiased view on this, i have never heard fto owners say that integra interiors are nicer, but i have heard honda owners say fto interior is nicer... like a few posts in this topic already.
^ from my 'unbiased' point of view, i'd have to agree with what you've said.
The dc2r interior is a lot more dated than the Fto interior... It was probably designed with function over form.
I believe that on track, the dc2r is going to be the better performer. And you'd hope so considering that honda went through all the effort of designing it with those merits in mind.
But in the end there's only one way to find out :P...
As for comfort
Yes, the Fto is more comfy, but by how much?
remember there is a compromise between performance and comfort (generally)
My frinds FTO manual V6 goes pretty hard
Second gear can hit 115 km +
I've seen it, driven it
But it doesnt feel as magical as the Type R
The fun factor (for me) was below average
He's got some work done to it, but when he takes my car for a spin, he luvs it
The revs (even thoguh mine is relatively stock, with just zorst)
The wheelspin, the ease of driving
And he always compliments on the Rs gearbox, so smooth yet feels so strong
Try to shift the Fto like an R, you'll feel like ur killing the gearbox, no feel, just lifeless
And as for the recaros, he said to me "Hong, how much?"
He absolutely 1uvs the fact that corners can be taken without u feeling like ur falling out of the seat, and also by having that hug, it gives u more confidence entering and exiting the corner as you don't have to correct ur position
Regards, Hong
yes youre not really talking about comfort anymore are you.... yes of course the recaros hug you and hold you in place there is no denying that and if you find that comfortable for daily driving then good for you, and if you appreciate it on the track then good for you too, i havent seen people have much troubles taking the FTO on track and fully gunning it on the bends thats for sure... in my view the FTO is a good compromise between comfort and performance... and no denying that the typeR is a hard-edged racers car and i can see why people fall in love with it and are willing to compromise bit of comfort and luxuries even for public road use.
In regard to straight line winners, im thinking about hitting WSID soon.
Id be more than happy to give some Integra owners a run.
Just for a bit of fun :)
Just got to sort out my clutch.
p.s i own an FTO.
nah fair comment im on your sied with this one. if it hasnt got a :honda: on it, it aint nuthingQuote:
Originally Posted by 91'lude
I used to drive a FTO GPX and now have a DC2R and IMO i wouldn't even compare the 2 cars... FTO claims bigger hp numbers but on the road it's a different story... if you must compare the 2 the DC2R provides a more comfortable ride that you'll actually enjoy driving, the FTO is a nice car but the DC2R is much better... :D
Why wouldnt you compare them? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by kOncept
cos i dislike mitsubitchi's after that FTO, i dislike all mitsu's except the EVOs...
just from personal experience:
Handling:
Type R: 1
GPX: 0
Comfort:
Type R: 1
GPX: 0
4 cyl vs 6 cyl:
Type R: 1
GPX: 0
Think about it, Mitsubitchi needed a MIVEC 6 to compete with HONDA's VTEC 4 and they still lost which would you prefer? heavy fuel consumption and less GO GO or good fuel consumption and power on tap? :)
also as edw said cornering hard in an FTO just simply doesn't feel the same as in an R the R is a much tighter package in terms of handling...
Obviously Mitsubishi don't wanna put too much effort on the FTO, since they have better market on the EVOs
VersionR i would like to give you a run in mum's integra. She has a stock 2004 Integra TypeS. :) :)
now u're talking about dc5's.. -_-
but VersionR said he's take on any integra at WSID ;)
For sure :)Quote:
Originally Posted by _CiVIC_
I dont care if i get an absolute thrashing - its all good fun!
We should make a Integra / FTO night at WSID out of it.
:thumbsup: More people need to adopt this attitude:thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by VersionR
maate, ITR might be good
but you can't beat the deep sound of a v6 mivec
the transition sound on mivec sounds so much better
****in vtec sounds like angry bees
well im gonna start the ball rolling next week and try and organise a WSID meet.
"DC2R the best handling FWD in the world "
Thats a pretty big statement. I agree that the itr is awesome, strightline and cornering but I don't think I'd say best in the world.
It's Honda that claim that Integra is the best FWD handling car in the world... Have you seen Best Motoring where a Type-R kills a WRX around a hairpin curve? It is the most amusing thing... hehe... and the DC2R had the outside line too... and BM videos test cars on track in full stock form too...
As far as the sound of V6 Mivec versus DC2R 4-cyl... I have driven my friend's FTO and he himself also says that my car sounds better... hehe... and if you think that's bad... Have you heard a DC2R with a Mugen intake? Hehe... sounds even better!
i cant think of any other FF car that can keep up with the honda R family
fto's sound pretty good. heard a few with an exhaust. its got that smooth high revving v6 sound.
wtf.. 2 years late buddy
hehehehe........classic!!!
FTO V6 sound is an aural orgasm
Sound unbelievable
No doubt there is not a single 4cyl VTEC that would sound better
It's been a wierd couple of days. Who's recovering from the weekend? Anyone?