Advance timing

ok say it is 16 degress...should i advance it til and only 18 degress?

How will u know when it is 18 degrees?

http://hondata.com/dynocivicsi.html

interesting read here

there is a huge difference between a tuned stock b16a and untuned stock b16a

the 3 timing marks are 14,16,18deg respectively from memory

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Originally Posted by ProECU

the 3 timing marks are 14,16,18deg respectively from memory

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Mr ProEcu is correct and there is also a TDC mark on the balancer as well the 16 degree make normally has white paint on it to show you the correct one.You gota love Honda :thumbsup:
Regards Dyno Dave

Why don't honda just have one mark on the crank pully?

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Originally Posted by DynoDave

Mr ProEcu is correct and there is also a TDC mark on the balancer as well the 16 degree make normally has white paint on it to show you the correct one.You gota love Honda :thumbsup:
Regards Dyno Dave

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Just confirming that the white mark is #1 TDC ?

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Originally Posted by wynode

Just confirming that the white mark is #1 TDC ?

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Ok I have a new B-Series balancer in my hands and the white mark is TDC and the 16 degree mark is a faint pink colour.
Regards Dyno Dave

ok.. good thread....

correct me if i m wrong, if u use higher octane fuel than recommended by Honda, u MUST advance the ignition timing.....

but how come when i use ron98 i feel my car is more responsive and has more power yet i didnt adjust the ignition timing.... and when i use ron95 back, i feel the engine is noisier and heavier....
so do i still need to advance the timing when i m using the ron98 fuel cos i m going to use ron98 fuel on my car....

thanx in advance....

I heard some people said: If you use higher octane fuel, you can advance your timing a bit to get a bit of power. Is it right?

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Originally Posted by Zimp13

ok.. good thread....

correct me if i m wrong, if u use higher octane fuel than recommended by Honda, u MUST advance the ignition timing.....

but how come when i use ron98 i feel my car is more responsive and has more power yet i didnt adjust the ignition timing.... and when i use ron95 back, i feel the engine is noisier and heavier....
so do i still need to advance the timing when i m using the ron98 fuel cos i m going to use ron98 fuel on my car....

thanx in advance....

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Most of you guys and girls that run the new 98 octane fuel could bump up the timing 2 degrees but unless its done on a dyno to see the results I would not recommend doing this.This will effect your AFR's because moving the timing will also effect the way the engine burns fuel.When I get a chance with the next Honda Im tuning on the dyno I will do a test and post it up to show you the effect that 2 degree's of timing has.
Regards Dyno Dave

dynodave...when u say u will bump up the degrees by 2...are you referring to bumping up the advancment from 16 to 18 degrees?

For Astro,
Yeah, I assume DynoDave is referring to a 2 degree increase.

For Zimp13,
You may find that 95RON fuel even with stock ignition timing is causing your engine to labour by burning less cleanly/efficiently as 98RON. Therefore, you will feel it in the seat of your pants. Advancing the timing should yield a better combustion and result in more power, as already discussed.

Personally, I use 98RON with a few mL's per litre of Toluene(this sh!t causes cancer, do not get liquid on your skin!) mixed in, to get around 103RON.

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Originally Posted by iamhappy46

For Astro,
Yeah, I assume DynoDave is referring to a 2 degree increase.

For Zimp13,
You may find that 95RON fuel even with stock ignition timing is causing your engine to labour by burning less cleanly/efficiently as 98RON. Therefore, you will feel it in the seat of your pants. Advancing the timing should yield a better combustion and result in more power, as already discussed.

Personally, I use 98RON with a few mL's per litre of Toluene(this sh!t causes cancer, do not get liquid on your skin!) mixed in, to get around 103RON.

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Thanks for the advise iamhappy46....

I ll advance the timing by max 3 degrees i think cos i ve changed to pod filter and has full exhaust system from header to the muffler...... lets c wat happen... heheheh

as for the Toluene, can i get this easily? at autobarn or repco or burson? i ll check it out later..... :D

I think it has a optium point of the timing. Who know? Different car use different fuel and has different compression.
For the best timing of each car, go to highest timing point that without pinking. That's my opinion. Correct me if i'm wrong.

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Originally Posted by Astro

dynodave...when u say u will bump up the degrees by 2...are you referring to bumping up the advancment from 16 to 18 degrees?

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Yes that is what I was saying take it upto 18 degree's.
Regards Dyno Dave

i went to look at the ignition timing laser gun... they are costly... cheapest is $50, up to $100... i dun mind buying one but all of them look so cheap (in quality wise) for that kind of price and there is none like the one in this link http://www.sohchonda.com/ipw-web/bul...ndex.php?pid=5.

someone mentioned in this thread only costs $20.... where can we get them from???
i ve gone to supercheap auto, repco, autobarn....

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Originally Posted by edw-R

I think it has a optium point of the timing. Who know? Different car use different fuel and has different compression.
For the best timing of each car, go to highest timing point that without pinking. That's my opinion. Correct me if i'm wrong.

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usually, you're going to tune timing to best mean torque... that requires a dyno though.

If you advance to the point of detonation, I'd retard by a degree and a half to two for safety reasons.

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Originally Posted by saxman

usually, you're going to tune timing to best mean torque... that requires a dyno though.

If you advance to the point of detonation, I'd retard by a degree and a half to two for safety reasons.

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At least a two degrees... In some cases, there may be MANY degrees of timing between MBTT and knock, and even then, tuners may retard a few degrees from MBTT.

If your not going to use a dyno, timing maps IMO should be very conservative, unless you don't care about your engine. With FI, one knock at high boost/rpm is all it takes and you have a nice hole in your piston, or a lovely bend in your rod.. Nice for a wall ornament, but not for an engine :D

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Originally Posted by string

At least a two degrees... In some cases, there may be MANY degrees of timing between MBTT and knock, and even then, tuners may retard a few degrees from MBTT.

If your not going to use a dyno, timing maps IMO should be very conservative, unless you don't care about your engine. With FI, one knock at high boost/rpm is all it takes and you have a nice hole in your piston, or a lovely bend in your rod.. Nice for a wall ornament, but not for an engine :D

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yah, I know... my point was that without a dyno, you're kinda shooting in the dark, and going until the point of detonation and stopping there isn't the way

Ignition timing, for most purposes can have base timing advanced by 2 degrees(which is within Honda's specifications) to take advantage of 98 octane fuel. For example, using Toluene, I can advance timing by 4 degrees past my 'SAFE' 98 octane point without suffering knock. Toluene is not an over the counter purchase anymore, we have a few drums stockpiled for personal use only.
Of course using a 'racing brewed' fuel is always going to give a larger power gain with more potential energy from timing adjustments. Nitro-methanol is one of the best with a rating of around 200+ octane and insane power outputs. Shame it requires 6:1 air:fuel rations (very rich miture) at $20 a litre...