Oil choice dilemma ....

Gonna be a hard time getting that ****er off. I put mine on hand tight and getting it off needs a tool.

Reading the crap about cars not starting when using thicker oil, I gotta say, you guys dont know what those numbers means if you say its waaaaay too thick.
The only relevant number at start up is the 15W. Compare that to the 10W of FEO and its not a very large difference. This number is the oils thickness at something like -18 celsius. So is more indicative of the oils thickness at start up.
Ill admit that the operating temperature thickness of 60 is a bit excessive and if you had vtec, it might make it difficult to make the switch from low to hi cam.

Essentially, for best protection against wear, you would use the thinnest oil you can at start-up and the right thickness to maintain the right oil pressure at operating temperature. Yeah, you might leak some thin oil when your engine is cold, but the can circulates the thin oil a lot easier, meaning you get coverage sooner than for a thicker oil.

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Originally Posted by dougie_504

Wait a minute, did you tighten up your oil filter? Good luck getting it off lol

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Got my last one OEM filter off easily - I make it tight but not wring the sh*t out of it - just have to make sure you oil the gasket before you put it on so it doesn't bake itself on; if you didn't oil your gasket then I agree you would struggle getting it off...

what i do to get a oil filter off is get a screwdriver and a hammer, toward the end of the filter punch a hole through with the screwdriver. then just twist it off with the screwdriver

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Originally Posted by dc2r-0636

what i do to get a oil filter off is get a screwdriver and a hammer, toward the end of the filter punch a hole through with the screwdriver. then just twist it off with the screwdriver

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love it, but think you might need the removal tool LOL

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Originally Posted by Alvis

love it, but think you might need the removal tool LOL

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lmao, give it a try next time !

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Originally Posted by dc2r-0636

lmao, give it a try next time !

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lol - if I did i'd get oil and sh*t everywhere haha

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Originally Posted by Alvis

lol - if I did i'd get oil and sh*t everywhere haha

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lol yeah that does happen but its worth it when u got no other way of getting it out, ive got 3 oil filter wrenches at home, and not one is small enough for the honda filter lol

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Originally Posted by dc2r-0636

lol yeah that does happen but its worth it when u got no other way of getting it out, ive got 3 oil filter wrenches at home, and not one is small enough for the honda filter lol

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Your friend :)

http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/5482/picture1uv.jpg
By civica at 2011-01-05

And this one isn't too bad - my Dad has this one and is good for other aftermarket filters - but only to get filters off - can't tighten up with this one. Trust me. I tried. Only to be told half hour later after trying that it's a removal tool only lol

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/1504/picture2br.jpg
By civica at 2011-01-05

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Originally Posted by dougie_504

The part I struggle with is that lots of aftermarket parts are considered better for an engine. For example, an aftermarket header is often lighter, produces more power and therefore performs better than the OEM one. That's just an example, not my rationale, but hopefully you get the drift. I think I'm just tired of endless people saying 'Just use Honda MTF it's made for it' etc when I question whether or not they've ever tried and felt the difference.

So why can't another brand of oil be better? Good quality aftermarket parts and consumables are supposed to equal or perform better than OEM due to their R&D and refinement after observing the OEM example, right? I have also seen several experienced and respected engine builders prefer other products than the OEM options.

I think Nulon for power, Royal Purple for protection.

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i think if i was to do a serious build i would do some research on getting better quality oils - but for all the motors i have worked on that have mainly been I/H/E i have been happy with OEM Honda

alot of the guys with worked K20 at track days say that FEO is not good enough for constant high revs and they use quality full synthetics - but 5ltrs of that stuff is like $150

i would maybe pay that for quality gearbox oil but not a D-series engine oil that gets changed every 5-10k kms

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Originally Posted by markismaximus

you're only meant to hand tighten oil filters. 3/4 turn approx once gasket contacts the block

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+1

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Originally Posted by Alvis

Are you sure? Then why does Honda make an oil filter tool to tighten them then - I know cause I bought one from Honda...

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Tool is for removal

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dougie_504

The part I struggle with is that lots of aftermarket parts are considered better for an engine. For example, an aftermarket header is often lighter, produces more power and therefore performs better than the OEM one. That's just an example, not my rationale, but hopefully you get the drift. I think I'm just tired of endless people saying 'Just use Honda MTF it's made for it' etc when I question whether or not they've ever tried and felt the difference.

So why can't another brand of oil be better? Good quality aftermarket parts and consumables are supposed to equal or perform better than OEM due to their R&D and refinement after observing the OEM example, right? I have also seen several experienced and respected engine builders prefer other products than the OEM options.

I think Nulon for power, Royal Purple for protection.

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How can an oil give you power?

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Originally Posted by gumus89

Reading the crap about cars not starting when using thicker oil, I gotta say, you guys dont know what those numbers means if you say its waaaaay too thick.
The only relevant number at start up is the 15W. Compare that to the 10W of FEO and its not a very large difference. This number is the oils thickness at something like -18 celsius. So is more indicative of the oils thickness at start up.
Ill admit that the operating temperature thickness of 60 is a bit excessive and if you had vtec, it might make it difficult to make the switch from low to hi cam.

Essentially, for best protection against wear, you would use the thinnest oil you can at start-up and the right thickness to maintain the right oil pressure at operating temperature. Yeah, you might leak some thin oil when your engine is cold, but the can circulates the thin oil a lot easier, meaning you get coverage sooner than for a thicker oil.

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With our Honda's, when the car hasn't been started for a few days, you can hear when the oil gets to the head to lubricate the head.
At 1st start up, you'll hear very loud tappet noise for maybe 1 or 2 seconds. After that, it turns quiet like normal again indicating the oil has reached the head to lubricate it.

On my fathers old Toyota Corona, he uses very poor quality "Gulf Western" oil rated at 20w-50.
At start up, you hear loud valve train noise and it doesn't become quiet till after around 10 seconds.
Thats a fairly long time to wait to get oil up to the valve train/head. I'm assuming that it is because of the poor quality & high viscosity rating of 20w.

Mind you, it only takes that long when the motor hasn't been started for a few days.

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Originally Posted by Alvis

just have to make sure you oil the gasket before you put it on so it doesn't bake itself on;

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The purpose of applying a thin film of oil onto the gasket before installation is for making the installation of the oil filter easier.
(Dry rubber rubbing up against the oil filter housing doesn't do the rubber gasket any good.)

The thin film of oil is not for the prevention of baking the gasket.

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Originally Posted by dc2r-0636

what i do to get a oil filter off is get a screwdriver and a hammer, toward the end of the filter punch a hole through with the screwdriver. then just twist it off with the screwdriver

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Dude, thats like worse case senario, when you've tried eveything and all else fails.

Doing that everytime you change a filter..............come on man........ don't be so n00b

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Originally Posted by Alvis

but only to get filters off -

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Dude, oil filters are only meant to be tightened by hand.

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Originally Posted by Bludger

Dude, oil filters are only meant to be tightened by hand.

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well if you do that, you better make sure you tighten it after the first run because I can guarantee you it will loosen up - happened to me last week. Search the net for stories on people who have blown engines because their oil filters have come off.

Surely a couple of turns with an oil cap tool isn't going to hurt anyone and gives you peace of mind

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Alvis

well if you do that, you better make sure you tighten it after the first run because I can guarantee you it will loosen up - happened to me last week. Search the net for stories on people who have blown engines because their oil filters have come off.

Surely a couple of turns with an oil cap tool isn't going to hurt anyone and gives you peace of mind

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you vs the entire world of car mechanics ? Oil remover tools generally will NOT tighten. They are geared/slack to loosen only.

A oil filter is to be tightened by hand only. It is around 25nm torque spec - this is measurable by only a small torque wrench.

First - lube the O ring with fresh oil. Next place the oil filter on , tighten by hand finger tight. Next grab a rag and rub down the oil filter cleaning any grease or oil off it. Finally give the oil filter a good grab and twist clockwise a decent amount to tighten. This should be around the 20-25nm mark.
Fill oil start engine check for leaks.