I see, thx for clearing that up.
Meh using 6th at 50/60km is too much hassle for what its worth anyway, i'd rather use 4th and pay an extra $2 at the pump... It was just a one-off thing I wanted to try.
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I see, thx for clearing that up.
Meh using 6th at 50/60km is too much hassle for what its worth anyway, i'd rather use 4th and pay an extra $2 at the pump... It was just a one-off thing I wanted to try.
Ahhhhh, yfin you have answered my long sort after Q, why the Euro has throttle lag. I got a whole lot of waffle from Honda who mumbled about digital equations converting to analogue with a triple bypass and a bowel replacement. So it is the lag from nil fuel to fuel flow, hmm, Honda should be able to resolve that. Thanks for that gem now do you know how to fix the problem? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by yfin
Adagio
I don't see it as "lag" - it is like a "bump" or "jerk" you can feel in power delivery (most noticeably when you are using cruise control up and down hills). It actually took me a long time to even notice this was happening it is so insignificant IMO. Play around with how you apply the throttle - sometimes if you are very gradual - ie tiny application and then gradual - there is no jerk at all. Give that a go.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adagio
Honda could change this but they aren't going to do it for your model or car alone - maybe future revisions of the vehicle might see changes. As the injectors shut off everytime you take your foot off the gas think of it as a good thing - saving you fuel.
By the way - I don't know what RPM the injectors cut off when rolling in gear. There might be some minimum RPM for it to happen? There also could be a minimum of time you need to be off the throttle - eg if you are on and off the throttle very quickly - there is no jerk aye? I noticed that. I think the ECU waits to see whether the car is definately going to be rolling in gear without throttle for a mininum set period before shutting off the injectors.
The slight lag when using cruise control doesn't bother me at all. Where I get annoyed is when I am in a parking mode and the car jerks hard when a slight amount of throttle is applied. I overcome this by coasting and feathering the clutch if necessary (which I hate to do). As I drove tourists around Europe I had to learn to drive smoothly that's why this throttle lag bugs me more than most. Maybe a tweak on the ECU might work. I don't think our local Honda dealer is up to it so are there any specialist between the Southern Highlands and Sydney or Canberra??
Adagio
Possibly because there is fuel still in the injectors and fuel lines no where to go waiting to be burnt.Quote:
Originally Posted by yfin
I thought the "throttle lag" ppl were talking about was the slight throttle responce lag when you push down on the accellerator due to the drive-by-wire system. confused again lol :p
Confused? yeah so am I. Are these two different problems or one manifesting in different ways?
Adagio
I just did a drive from bris to syd then back again over last weekend, fuel economy was brilliant, infact there's probley enough juice to do the ~940k between Sydney and my house on the south side of Bris. Anyway, filled up after some bris city driving after returning, 925km on trip and put 60.51L of BP Ult back in the tank, which by my math is around 6.5L/100km.
Those figures look good but to keep to reality try doing a 4 fill up average driving normally, whatever normally is for you. Someone else said earlier not to tress the engine with too low revs. I seem to think that 2,000rpm is ok on a trailing throttle and 3,000 rpm at least if accelerating. These RPMs may need to be verified by those more enlightened (qualified) than me.
Adagio
What do you mean by "shuts off the injectors"? Won't the engine stop if the petrol is stopped?Quote:
Originally Posted by yfin
No, from what ive gathered, it shuts them off when the car is engine braking, but they turn back on at ~900rpm to keep idle speed and avoid stalling.
We just back from Noosa this w/end and got pretty good economy. 450km's on half a tank, 95% highway driving. There were about 10km's of 60km/h or slower on the Bruce Hwy due to too much traffic and about 40km's around Noosa on Saturday arvo. There were of course the occasional VTEC yo! spirts to pass slow drivers :)
Anyone tried the optimax extreme? and a comparison to normal optimax?
I did a mistake today by fueling mobil6000 :( (bloody mobil, it was 4am in the morning and it said premium unleaded until I walked to the next pump and there was mobil8000) I've used half the tank now, reckon i should top it up with extreme to even it out?
Mobil 6000 is 95 octane and will be ok for your Euro. If you don't feel good, go ahead and top up with a 98 octane (Mobil 8000). No point putting in Extreme if you don't have a reason to put 100 octane in.
it's quite interesting, that this time when i filled up the tank, the trip meter only says 607km, usually when i top up it says 742km on optimax. Dat's what triggered myself to look at the fuel that i just put in at the station and realised there was mobil8000. Does the ECU have any detecting device?
Any difference between Mobil6000 and 8000?
Mobil 8000 is 98 octane like optimax but i think its cleaner and less addictives than optimax. Mobil 6000 is 95 octane.
i prefer Ultimate > 8000 > optimax
Mobil Synergy 6000 is infact 96RON in Melbourne. Not sure in other states? Would imagine the same.
In NZ they dropped the 96RON and thus changed the name to Synergy 5000 instead :S
I just read some issue of MOTOR today and BP Ultimate had this big page advertisement saying it is like a change from a 2.6L to a 3.0L car (I think.) just changing to BP Ultimate fuel, also quicker acceleration and more mileage. I think we could sue BP Ultimate for misleading the customer considering the RACV's Ford Festiva and Falcon test done by RACV and using BP fuels, showed otherwise...
As for Ultimate 98, Synergy 98 and Optimax 98 - in the Euro Accord I can't feel much difference. Syn 8000 seat of the pants to me, but I think I might be dreaming.. :(
I know it's probably been discussed to death but I can't find it.
Any Euro, Optimax vs Ultimate vs Syn8000 vs Vortex comments?
I know a lot of people reckon Ultimate is better than Optimax, why?
Uhh.. why can't you find it!?!?! I bet you didn't search. I'll let you off this time :p Read this from start to end: http://ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26880 Please read the posts. And please use the search functionQuote:
Originally Posted by nickowns
And.... people reckon Ultimate is better than optimax because of what EK4R just said 3 posts up. It's supposedly uses less additives to reach 98 oct.
damn it didnt come up on page 1 of search and popped up on page 2!
:D sorry about that aaronng, I typed optimax vs BP ultimate in the search, i swear i did! hehehe.
anyways thanks for that.
I'm gonna go do some BP ultimate fills to see :)
2,900 at 120!?!?!Quote:
Originally Posted by Adagio
the gearing in 6th is crap on the s2k IMO, good for racing i suppose but not really for real world driving.
S2k revs at 3,500 @ 100km/h in 6th
lol im in 4,000RPM when im at 110km/hr already :(
Funny how with the fuel price so high, I gained an extra 55km fuel economy.
Using the same fuel as always - Synergy 8000.
In fact, assuming I top up my fuel tank to same level everytime, doing my calculations of how many litres I put in, my normal consumption is nearly always the same, +/- 15-20 Kms.
Until the fuel price went up, that is :S
I found that using 98RON (Mobil) decreases fuel consuption by almost 1L/km compared to 95RON BP fuel.
On 95RON I was trying hard to get good consumption, but it sat at an average 11.2 where as 98RON averaged at 10.3 without even trying (actually Ive been revving higher than usual).
Hey - that's not fair, coz u've been revving using Mobil Synergy 8000!
U know, the way I drive the car is, I rev it everyday. Which makes it fairly consistent. The car has broken in now, I could feel it loosen.
With Synergy 8000 vs Optimax 98, I get on average 20-30Kms more. Driving exactly the same.
I have the worst fuel consumption of everyone in here by the way, I don't even bother posting. Its my leaded foot.
rofl now i'm curious, what is your fuel consumption?
13L/km? ... 15L/km? :eek:
Dammit, the wife just achieved 6.4L/100km on her own on a 110-120 cruise to Queanbeyan and back to the, lol, congested Southern Highlands. My previous on a similar run was 7.3 two up the other being, guess who;)
I just did a Sydney to Canberra trip in total FOG and I can only see 5 metres infront of me for about 2 hours out of the 3 hour drive. I regret not getting the fog lights :(
Anyways, I noticed my fuel consumption is very bad this time about 8.5L/100km with the weather ranging from -4 to about 3 degrees 80% of the way, usually the trip is a really good cruise at about high 6 to mid 7ishL/100km. Anyone else experience the same?
I think its the opposite for me. Today it was very cold (like 12c) and my fuel consump was 9.4 to 9.9 in heavy traffic. My last fuel tank was giving 10.3 to 11.4 a week ago in warmer weather (20c). Same fuel (BP Ultimate), same traffic.
I'm guessing because the car performs better due to more oxygen in cold weather, so you dont need to rev as high.
but 12 degrees is hardly the -4 to 3 degrees range I must say :)
I'd almost think that there's a threshold of temperature for optimum fuel combustion. shrugs.
nickowns: isnt it dangerous to be driving in conditions like that? 5metres ahead a ghost could just pop infront of yr car & driving like that for 2 hours. Maximum Stress! -4C as well!.
O yes let me tell you, I've never had such dangerous driving conditions like that. lucky I switch to the right lane and drove, there were heaps of rabbits and other forms of nature on the left side of the road, I think even the nature itself got lost and found themselves on the road.
I slowed down in parts of the 110 zone to about 60 because they didn;t put the bloody road reflectors in.
ever since i picked up my car from the dealer, the majority of my fuel has been 98 vortex (caltex) or bp ultimate.....98oct only for my euro....lol
what i have noticed is that i get better fuel consumption with bp ultimate...i've been thinking that it's just different conditions, driving habits, etc, but it's been like this multiple times....the results are reproducible and consistent...
on vortex, i get about approx 10.5L/100kms
on ultimate, i get about 9.2L/100kms...
BIG difference...
what does everyone reckon when they use it?
and oh, it's all city driving....
I live in the region Nickdowns has just travelled through. We wouldn't own a car here unless it had fog lights. Pity the Accord Euro Luxury does not have rear foglights even a Hyena Excel has them. Last consumption using, mostly BP Ultimate was 6.8L/100kms. Yes, wet cool weather does make a difference as it is denser and consequently carries more oxygen so you get more bang for your buck. This type of weather sends diesel cars/trucks in utter joy as we find with our Peugeot 405 diesel which, by the way, gets just under 6L/100 and has a 1.9 litre engine and 270,000 on the clock. That's very good but I am astounded with the Accord with its average of 6.95L/100km in identical driving conditions.
Adagio
Im getting 6.7l/100k on a trip from Forbes to Wollongong, and use Vortex. I sometimes throw in Ultimate for the trip back but i do no better or worse.
BP Ultimate 98RON = 9.4L average.
Others 98RON = ~10.3L average
Premium 95RON = ~10.xL/11.xL
Now running in my 06 Euro - the fuel consumption meter reads 10.8L - and the Euro's done 500k's now ..... filled up with Vortex lately and before that was Shell Premium Unleaded .....
Average consumption for life of car is down to 10l/100km. Typical driving has gone from 14-15l/100km down to 11-12l/100km. Typical driving meaning over a tankful I would do approx. 80-100 highway kms and the rest cold start city driving to work in traffic. I have done a couple of long highway trips which has brought the overall figure down. I still also find that the indicated economy in the trip computer is incorrect. EG trip computer will show say 10.8 when the actual is 11.5 or worse.Quote:
Originally Posted by YouRow
Mostly I put the poor economy down to running rich when cold - the average consumption increases by .5l in the first five minutes of driving, then stabilises even though the driving conditions do not change.
But as far as the figures I have seen almost all of you quote (bearing in mind mine's auto so obviously it'll be worse) mine never gets anywhere near them except on the open road. I am a very economical driver and I hardly ever get past 3500 rpm or plant my foot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YouRow
that's really odd...i do 100% city driving with no highway kms at all...(manual trans)..
every morning mon-fri i do cold start driving for about 10-15mins driving my sis to the train station...
everything else is city driving to work, usually a 20km trip from home to the city...
and i am occasionally a lead foot driver...sometimes i just feel the urge to hear the engine rev to about 5000rpm in 2nd gear...i would say i do this about 4-5 times in my 20km trip to or home from the city...
worse i've ever done was approx 11.5L....this occurred once during the first 500kms of the car....2nd time was my last fuel tank of caltex 98 vortex...
my current tank of 98 vortex is at exactly 10.0L/100kms...averaged with half of the fuel tank used...
i'm going to pour bp ultimate the next few tanks and see again how my figures are...if consistent with my low 9's/100kms i'm gonna pour ultimate from now on...
bugger the 4c off per litre crap u get from shopping....works out to only be like $2 off per 50L anyway!
As for observation of BP vs mobil vs shell.
It's really weird, I find that if I constantly put in mobil 8000 or BP Ultiamte, I can avg 9.xL/100km, Shell optimax is only very little better than the 2 but if I mix Shell optimax with either BP or Mobil (about 50/50 portion), I seem to get a lot of more, consistently under 8.5L/100km, usually the low 8s.
Anyone else experience the same?
Maybe I'll try this - mix Optimax and Bp Ultimate 50/50 and see how I goQuote:
Originally Posted by nickowns
hehe wander what happens if you mix 98RON with 90RON, will it effectively be 95RON at a cheaper price? :p
well I dont know what the mixing does, but I always thought the difference between the 3 fuels are that they put different additives into the fuel to make it 'distinct', so by mixing these, surely you can get a super combintion additive power lol, just a thought. Ultimmaxnergy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickowns
Which is all good, unless the additives conflict with each other and cause an engine meltdown :p
Just my contribution on the topic of Euro fuel economy.
Euro manual 06 model. 6000km on the clock.
Running on mainly Caltex Vortex 95RON.
Usage normally 50:50 city to highway running.
Fuel consumption has been between 8.0 to 8.9 Lt/100km so far.
Overall average of 8.5Lts/100km.
Figures calculated from actual fuel refill volumes/kms and not from trip computer consumption (which always reads lower than actual).
I have run a few tanks of 98RON recently, but so far I have found this has not made any difference to fuel consumption at all. However, I have noticed that engine performance down low (1000 to 2500rpm) is much better. Today while coasting along with the traffic I pulled away in 3rd gear at 1200rpm ... it was so smooth and responsive! Normally I'd slip down to 2nd to avoid the engine labouring/shuddering, but it appears that running on 98RON has taken that problem away. Some improvement in low-down torque perhaps?
Havent noticed much of an improvement in performance at the upper end of the rev range yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by corn_flakes
Mine's at 4300km total, this tank 100% city driving is 12l/100km... I only use Optimax, I used Ultimate once and got even worse consumption!! Normal trip to work is only 10km/20mins which is why I think it's so bad. Although when I drive a longer town trip, it's only slightly better. It has improved a lot, from 15l/100, so I only hope it gets better as the kilometres go by... Tonight from starting the car to going 100m up the road the avg consumption increased by 0.3l/100km!!
Model: Euro Sport (automatic) 2006.
Mods: No non-factory mods. 17" Bridgestone Potenza's (stock) 32-33psi front/30-31psi rear (checked every 500hm so far / full tank refuel)
Kms: According to the trip computer: 650km at an average of 10.1L/km.
Mixture of 15km freeway + short trips.
Fuel: BP ultimate.
TanaLasta: Your consumption I must say is very low. Most of the AutoTranny guys in here like me get 12L+/100km.
Whats your secret? Hammer it down often?
There are probably fewer traffic lights in teh city over at WA. Melb city has traffic lights every 50m! LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by jamwyn
Nice one Aaron, have you tried doing a Hook-Turn in Melb? Apparently some interstate drivers are scratching the thought of driving in CBD becos of this.
IN sydney CBD, Bahh I shall not even bring that up!
Suffice to say that WA Perth still has plenty of open freeways and highways uncluttered by traffic lights except in some areas / suburbs like FremantleQuote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
Otherwise it's pretty cruisy all the way around! :D
It's so easy though once someone explains. It's because interstate drivers have no idea how to do it. The first time we went down to melb, we ended up with lots of honking from the other drivers when we tried to do our own version of the hook turn. LOL. Now I know how to do it properly.Quote:
Originally Posted by jamwyn
Go along the left, and stop there, not blocking your lane. Wait til the light turns yellow, then start turning. haha. So easy and fun.
My gf just came back from melb. She says it's so difficult to drive there. Haha, I want to see a melb driver try to drive around Sydney cbd. It would be so funny and scary! Hehehe.
06 Euro Manual Lux drank 9.0L/100K for first 6000 clicks using HONDA oil only.
Lowest full tank avg consumption = 8.6
Hightest full tank avg consumption = 9.5 (heavy sydney traffic - makes me fang down back streets with satnav)
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
Hey... just want to tell u people that - in fact, u cannot legally turn until the traffic light of the direction u're turning towards become completely green!
If you start turning when the lights are yellow u can be caught, as my friend found out. Although what you said has some truth in it because most Melburnians get this part wrong and start turning when the original direction lights turn yellow! Sometimes if I wait too long so I do it 'properly' I even get the horn from behind, but who cares about them - I care about my wallet!
:o :( :o
I just started using BP Ultimate 98 finally in my car.
Previously have used SHELL 96, SHELL Optimax 98, Vortex 96 (no 98 in Vic yet I think), Mobile Synergy 8000.
I think BP Ultimate runs smoother in the Accord Euro than the other fuels, and feels more zippy than Optimax 98 seat of the pants. Between BP Ultimate 98 and Mobile Synergy 98? The engine sound is diff. Not entirely sure which is better performance wise.
Fuel economy wise, all fuels were to me the same. I might get 20kph more out of Synergy 8000 but then again it could just be my right foot adjusting to the fuel price? :O
Does any1 know if you can get Synergy 8000 in QLD? Some ppl rave about it and I wanna try it but can't find it anywhere. The only premium Mobil have here is 95RON.
My consumption has slowly been getting better. Car is up to 20K km's and now make 500-550km's per tank city driving. Not bad for an Auto I thought. When I first got the car it was 400-420 or so. Mind you I did hit VTEC more often as it was a novelty. :)
Ive had my car for about a month now.
The first full fill I did- on crap 7Elevn normal pump unleaded I was amazed to get 680kms out of the tank. I did drive well into the warning light aswell. All city driving..
Im not really fussed what fuel I put in it.
My old S15 would get about 460kms-Always 98+ Octane booster.
Im happy with the milage from a heavier car.
The Euro is meant to run on at least 95 octane. So please put premium or 98 before your engine suffers anymore predetonation...Quote:
Originally Posted by G7G7
Ah so it does. 95+
Better do that now hey.
Still have a few bottles of octane booster to chuck in.:thumbsup:
If you have 1/2 tank or less of 91 in there, you could fill up with 98. Or octane booster is good too (if you don't need it for your S15 that is). :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by G7G7
i converted back to BP ultimate after goin on optimax and vortex the last few fill ups....
and i'm finding my fuel consumption on ultimate quite consistent...running at 9.1-9.5L/100kms (100% city driving)...
on vortex and optimax i had +10.2L/100kms...
finding it quite weird though since other euro owners don't see the same result i do with ultimate...
must be my driving habits? :wave:
I wouldn't be using octane booster all the time, it's no good for your plugs!Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
Well, it's just for this once since he has a tank of 91 in his Euro. :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by tknova
Anyone else noticing their Euros drinking more fuel in the colder winter weather? Starting off in the mornings can add +2Lts/100km to the average in just the first few kilometres of driving! I'm definately worse off by +1Lts/100km for each tankful since the weather turned cold about 4 to 6 weeks ago. Not doing anything different, still using the same fuel.
At which RPM we should change the gear to get better fuel consumption? I usually change the gear between 2500-3000RPM.
In the Manual it tells you the optimal RPM to change gears.Quote:
Originally Posted by Atjo
Yeah I change at around 2500rpm, or rev up to 4000 and skip a gear. Sometimes I even rev 1st gear up to 5500rpm and dump it straight into 4th gear ;)
But going from 1st to fourth is a biatch, its virtually impossible to do it quickly without crunching.
But its not hard to judge for yourself. With a bit of trial and error, you get to know the cars abilities for determining the lowest RPM to shift at.
MY06 6MT at 6000km~
Average = 9.4
Highway = 8.5
Traffic = 9.8
Lowest ever = 5.0 (6th gear @ 90km/h with full tank)
Fuel consumption has improved considerably since new (It was often doing 14.0L when new)
I think you are just about right on for economy driving, don't go below 2,500rpm to change up otherwise it puts too much strain on the transmission. The main issue is keeping a reasonably constant throttle on long hauls.Contrary to popular belief you can achieve better fuel consumption NOT using the cruise control on highway drives. Anticipating topography changes and gently increasing or decreasing the throttle will give better consumption than leaving it up to the cruise control which tends to react too late. Having said all this the Euro Accord demands to be driven so enjoy the responsiveness of this brilliant engine and Vtec for your own enjoyment regularly, what's a few dollars anyway:). I do not understand those who skip several gears by revving in a low gear then dropping it into a several gears higher just to save changing gears, seems to me an automatic should have been their choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by Atjo
Adagio
14June06 - 26 June 06 = 10.28L/100km BP Ultimate
6 June-13June = 13.8L/100km Shell Optimax.
Oh Myy...... 1st time ever using Ultimate. Similar style of driving as well.
11.27L/100km - Average consumption of my Euro05-5AT since i bought her.
i love BP ultimate...
sorry, but my findings with the use of 98 oct ultimate are consistent every time...:)
BP Ultimate is great for mine too - usually topping at around 9.8L consistantly.
But I used another brand last fill up (think it was Shell or Ampol 98) and half a tank later its still sitting around 10.8-11.3L.
Same driving style...
yep...exactly what i notice...
ampol is still alive these days? lol i haven't seen one of their servos around for ages...hahaha
how do you guys find out the usage? my car has no fuel reading / 100km :(
Trip/Fuel computer was introduced in the 06' model.
do some math when you fill it up.Quote:
Originally Posted by petsfact
To calc consumption accurately:Quote:
Originally Posted by petsfact
1. Place fuel bowser nozzle in the tank hole and take note of the notch position. (notches are under the 'neck' of the nozzle) and fill until bowser clicks and stops.
2. Before driving off - reset the trip counter by pushing in the button near your speedo.
3. Next time you fill up, make sure you repeat step 1, and make sure you place the nozzle at the same notch. After you stop then do the simple math. eg. If you put in 48.4 litres and the odometer says 440 klms then you have been doing 11L / 100klms.
Here is the formula: Consumption Rate = (Total Refiled Litres / Klms Travelled) * 100
Don't forget when you fill to the top - to reset your trip-meter
My Euro MY06 5AT has clocked about 800km. Drinking 12.8L/100 on caltex 98 and bp ultimate.
That 's such a high volume considering I don't drive too hard, typical gear change from 2500 - 3000 rpm and no hard breaking. I mostly drive on suburb roads.
can anyone share some insights. is this high comsumption due to non breakin???? or because suburb roads?
800kims is very early days. That said, I have been following this thread and the auto Euro seems to have remarkably high consumption in the city. Not very good at all compared to the 6MT - even when the 6MT is pushed hard it is tough to get 12l/100.Quote:
Originally Posted by turbo56k
On the freeways both cars should be quite similar due to the gearing on the auto.
[QUOTE=turbo56k]My Euro MY06 5AT has clocked about 800km. Drinking 12.8L/100 on caltex 98 and bp ultimate.
At around the same kms I was getting 8.02 L/100kms. I drive a Euro Lux manual. Riight now I am at 20,000kms and averaging 7.52L/100kms in mostly country driving at 100kmh + AND I do Vtec frequently. Eurobro's fill up formula is excellent and to make it even easier when calculating just delete the decimal point from the litres used and divide by the kms travelled. I do think to give real indication of consumption you should average say, 4 fill ups. Those Honda diesels are looking more attractive each day as I watch fuel prices rise. I reckon the Accord Diesel would achieve at least 6L/100 kms. Our old Peugeot 405 diesel does this regularly.
Adagio
Quote:
Originally Posted by yfin
that's why i hate auto cars...crap fuel consumption, and a gearbox that can't make up it's mind...
but yeh...i've got a manual 06 euro...and in the first 1000kms, i used to get shit fuel consumption too...
about 11.5-12L/100kms...
and nowdays i get about 9.5 on BP ultimate, 10.5 on optimax or vortex...
and that's 100% city driving, and i do hit 6000rpm multiple times everytime i drive...