Double clutching

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Originally Posted by SIKCVC

Tractions not the issue here, if you attempt this at the same distance you would heel and toe your gonna end up off the track because you'll enter the corner too hot. Thats the biggest issue.

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I thought I'd established that it takes planning to drive at a reasonable pace on the track and use track techniques. If you'd planned on enough time to use such techniques why will you enter 'too hot'? entering a turn 'too hot' indicates poor planning as it means you've entered a turn at too high a speed to perform necessary manuevers!

How can traction not be an issue? Traction is an issue even in drifting...

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Originally Posted by SIKCVC

You've established nothing except for the fact that syncros will slowly die if you dont double the clutch. and Flat shifting is far more damaging to engine parts especially considering the engines are under considerable load on accell compared with decel.

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I'm really not so sure about this. They are both accelerative forces (i mean in a physics sense- changes in velocity). Why will acceleration put an engine under more load than deceleration if the change is at the same rate? Please explain this...

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Why will acceleration put an engine under more load than deceleration if the change is at the same rate? Please explain this...

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Its not at the same rate.

How can you compare the two without making them the same then?

I'm not comparing them? that was what my point was. I said that accell had more load on the engine etc then decel,

This is starting to feel like nitpicking. :D

omigosh, i don't visit ozhonda very often (only when ns.com is down), but couldn't help reading this thread! it seems like everyone here has no clue on these two techniques!! and you guys are suppose to be track warriors!

the only guy that has it right is VIPERX!!!! take time to read his post and think about it and it will make sense!! id type out the explanation in simple dot points but viperx has it right - just need to read it and think!!

and to those who think double clutching is used for up shifting... you've been watching too much f&f!!

Well no if you read the link viperx posted doubling the clutch used to be used on crash gear boxes up and down.

I see where viperx is coming from, needing the gear box revs matched in order to preserve the syncros... and I know I'm trying to learn the technique but if i need to down shift fast, I dont give a rats about doubling the clutch(ie my syncros) I just dont want compression lock due to low engine revs and hi road revs... which is my point for blipping the throttle.

and Viperx it only became nit picking when you made stupid nit picking rebutals. My main goal when down shifting into a corner, is to set myself up for the corner and the exit, I dont want to get caught out stumbling over peddles/taking to long to down shift... and i especially dont want to get compression lock. if that means matching engine to road revs without matching engine to gear box revs, so be it. Lets face it honda gear boxes can take a fair bit of punishment.

Why argue,...,a technique is good if it makes you go faster.......whatever works for the person,..., no one's right or wrong,..., race car drivers do what they do because it's proven, I believe there are some aftermarket ECU's that will incorporate a flat changing function. Otherwise, I wouldn't try it unless you love to buy new synchros

good call cyrus.

That's cool with me cyrus- i didnt accuse anyone of nitpicking. I only said that because I didnt feel like arguing anymore. And sikcvc, I have nothing against you, perhaps you worded your answers wrongly, but it just seems a little defensive for you to call my comments stupid. There is nothing technically wrong with what i described. I know what the limits to my knowledge and skill is and i don't feel the need to prove them to anyone, and I happily admitted I don't know what compression lock is, and I would like you to tell me if you're willing.

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Originally Posted by SIKCVC

And thats the ONLY time you would need to use it in a veihcle where the syncros are ****ed(this includes missing a gear and having to reset it) or not even syncro gear box... if you use it any other time your an idiot and deserve to be shot!!!

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But why are you trying to learn double clutching now?

c'mon children. double clutching is doule cluthing-- if you can master it.. good on ya...your synchros will love you for it...^_^,
all i know i love the feel of double clutchin when down gearing into a corner...it reduces the bounce of the car and allows you to take the corner at the right speed and revs ^_^=== great for hills ahahahaha

Well to be honest ViperX I learnt a lot of stuff I know from my dad who was a susy and exhaust expert. He has done a lot of work on cars over the years including gettings my mums mini to wheel spin in every gear. Not to mention being friends with that crazzy roller mechanic in europe with the car that has a spitfire engine in it.

He had told me the usage of Doubling the clutch, which was on crash boxes (or what ever he called them) where revs HAD to be match in order to get it into gear. Without matching revs of the layshaft, engine and road it just wouldn't mesh.

After reading that article/info peice I can understand why its usefull when time permits I will do what I can to preserve my gears... esspecially at downshifts around 5000-6000rpm but in the lower gears (tight quick corners)... sorry syncros speed is of the essence.

Compression lock up... http://forums.melbccr.com/showthread.php?t=65493&page=1