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Does anyone make such item? basically to replace the crappy rubber/plastic rubber pipe...
I don't want to go the route of running a pod filter, as i personally think it create more problem than what it tries to solve...
There's nothing wrong with the air box, so why change whats working....
Hey mate...you're exactly right. Why change whats working? The stock intake pipe will keep air temps lower compared to a metal pipe.Quote:
Originally Posted by mugen_ctr
ah really? hrmmm.... what about in terms of air flow? id assume the stock rubber arm is quite restrictive in terms of flow
get a 45deg or 90deg silcon tube - this will keep temps down and easily fit where the stock intake arm should be
i'm no expert on the topic but i'd say if you're talking about restriction it's the actual design of the stock airbox and snorkel which is most restrictive (note however tho the bell-mouth shaped duct leading from the airbox to the intake arm - tests have proven this type of bell-mouth actually reduces pressure so Honda definitely knew what they were doing): pic ur probably familiar with but you can see the bell-mouth shape below:
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/4...030521edit.jpg
By civica at 2010-06-20
Firstly however, the stock intake piping (which starts up, goes down and round and round lol) is not a front facing intake (that would be pressurised by the car's forward movement) which is probably one of the better setups around now and what you see on a lot of the newer cars these days. Secondly, the stock Honda airbox itself is a square box and has a lot of 'hard' edges. It really needs to be 'smooth' to encourage optimum airflow.
In terms of the rubber intake arm which connects to the intake manifold (it does look pretty ugly huh) you just need to be careful because the intake arm is tuned specifically to work with the throttle body, intake manifold etc and making this bigger may not be the best solution. I have a quote from the book '21st Century Performance' by Julian Edgar:
"... the length of pipe that connects the factory airbox with the throttle body has normally been carefully sized in diameter and length to provide effective intake resonant tuning. If this pipe is removed so a replacement filter can be mounted directly on the throttle body power is quite likely to fall. Dyno testing carried out on a Daihatsu Charade showed that power variations of more than 7% were possible across the mid-range when intake pipe lengths that ranged from 30cm to 100cm were fitted."
Further proof is really in the pudding if you look at Mugen and the intake they designed for the EK9 - you'll notice they didn't change the rubber intake arm - it connects into it. That's convincing enough for me given the R&D they undertake when testing performance products.
http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/6048/dsc8393.jpg
By civica at 2010-06-20
And yep (sorry for the long post), you're right there's no point getting an exposed pod filter - you'll actually decrease performance rather than increase it. And I have proof from a dyno run - see below (blue = stock filter and red = exposed pod filter).
Importantly, the run was also done with the bonnet down, not up with a fan blowing cold air over the top of the engine (which i'm assuming a lot of companies do to show pods increase performance):
http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/7382/abcd0007c.jpg
By civica at 2010-06-20
So, what's the answer? I'd say one of 3 options (cheapest to expensive):
1. Buy a high flowing panel filter (K&N) to replace factory paper one (leave stock box and intake arm)
2. Buy a pod filter (I've been told Fujita and Apexi are some of the best) and make a custom heat shield (protect filter from hot engine bay heat and helps stop engine detonation as a result of breathing hot air)
3. Buy a Mugen EK9 airbox!
Hope this post is helpful,
Hey mate, really good post. Thought I'd just add to it :PQuote:
Originally Posted by Alvis
I'm with Alvis, the stock intake pipe works well and flows excellent even if it is rubber and convoluted. The biggest factors influencing decreased flow are the air box and resonator chamber.
Just a quick question guys for this thread, what if you run the air box without resonator and have a cold air pipe to the air box?
would it be better than my current metal arm SRI ?
i have a feeling i heat soaked too much so i want to change back
well said man...
When i do get time, ill remove the resonator from the inside of bumper, and also the one on the intake pipe... to see if it make a difference, probs not.... lol, and when funds permit, a K&N panel filter
I personally think heat shields dont do any justice, as they jus cover the pod, an thats it... jus more so looks than function, its still sucking the hot air from the motor, unless u have a cold intake feed, than maybe so i can see the benefit, but other wise...
tsol0811 i was thinking of the same idea, keep the stock air box, and remove the resonator from the inside of bumper
intercooler piping and silicon piping can be bought from supercheap auto
they also have a full online catalogue
http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/
the parts arnt amazing quality but they do the job ... but its best to try improve on the oem system as best u can before modding
the best way to do this is to remove all resonators and get some cold air into the air box ... the stock intake arm isnt too bad ... the Dc2 integra intake arm is an awsome upgrade for civics =)
im getting heat soak on my simota SRI ... solution ... Fujita CAI kit lol
or u can build a heat sheild out of plasti-board and hi temp black paint =)
I strongly recommend against this as they are ridiculously priced. A 3" x 2" coupler is around $40 and a 90degree silicon coupler can cost $60 or more....whereas if you bought these off ebay or a performance work shop it works out much cheaper. Don't even get me started on their low-quality intercooler pipes!Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSaint
Hey man. Removing the resonators will make a big difference in air flow and sound. Taking off the one on the intake arm won't be that noticeable but the resonator chamber that sits inside your bumper will definitely be worth removing.Quote:
Originally Posted by mugen_ctr
Also, I have to disagree with your statement on heat shields. I think you are referring to the ones that just clip on the pod filter, which are still better than not having one at all. However the best solution for a short ram intake is building a custom heat shield such as the one made by aaronng, by completely concealing the filter from engine bay heat, whilst also feeding cold air to it by means of ram force.
built an intake for an XR6 using silicon + intercooler piping ... we also got an air dam from SS inductions
check out my civic build thread for infor on civic/xr6/liberty intakes =)
thanks guys. Off with the SRI this weekend and back on the OEM AIR BOX+ DIY cold air feed =)
maybe i was thinking of the clip on ones, lol, but the ones like mugen heat shield, yea that would def make a difference... as it totally encloses the pod from the rest of the engine bay
Looking at the ARC box, that would be nice addition over the stock box, but the cost is phenomenal, as its the closes to a factory air box replacement...
If you want a enclosed Cai intakeQuote:
Originally Posted by mugen_ctr
Why not try the K&N Apollo intake Its pretty good i heard and its enclosed + got cold air piping
only 200+ so affordable i guess I'dd leave the oem rubber pipe my metal one just heats up like a MOTHER f**ker
simota do an inline enclosed intake as well ... they are usually pretty well price on ebay =)
yea i agree, leave the rubber pipe as it doesn't soak up as much heat as comapared to metal, the apollo kit does look quite the treat for the price
Im finding it hard to find a location for the cold intake pipe, that feeds the outside air into the airbox.... seems honda didnt quite figure it out when they pieced the civics together... the rad and air con both consume the whole front, so theres no room to fit the rubber pipe from the mouth
i have a vented grill built into the front wheel arch liner
Today i took out my sri got my oem airbox back in today without the resonator its improved and some virbation noises were SOLVED :)
i have no room for cold air feed since i have foggies but atlease its well kept away from the engine bay heat.
pretty happy.
show us a pic of your engine bay
i removed my resonator on the intake pipe, some how its improved my fuel economy, i don't know how, but it did, i use to be getting 11 - 10 litres per 100kms (yea its running a bit rich), now getting closer to 13 - 15 liters per 100kms.... i was going to remove the resonator from the bumper, but than reliazed there was no way i could fit a cold air feed pipe to the air box... Now this could mean im running leaner fuel mixture, which is worse than running richer... but im not sure
I jus plugged it up with a Gatorade bottle cap
That definitely is not an improvement. I really don't see how removing a little resonator can affect mileage. I've done it on my cars before and there have never been ill effects. Take a picture of what you've done and show us
Yeah, i doubt that would happen...?
Take the resonator out of the bumper sounds better + some cold air is sucked in.
im going to makre a custome box for this with a CAI to add to the sexyness that is my engine bay LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by TheSaint
The stock rubber intake arm sheds heat easier than metal. Also, the amount of time the air spends shooting from your filter into your TB is nearly negligible when considering heat absorption from the engine. As long as the filter itself (like in a stock box) is protected from the residual heat then you don't need to worry.
If you want a little power kick just open your stock box, snap off all the little plastic fins and bits, anything that reduces tube diameter or isn't necessary. Put in a K&N panel filter, remove your stock resonator below the box and run some plumbing flex-pipe from the front of your bumped to the bottom of your box - there's a nice hole on the bottom of the intake box for the flex-pipe to connect to.
That way it's not loud, but you'll have an isolated CAI that flows much better than stock. Easiest form of CAI, no defect issues.
No need for expensive silicon or metal tubing. Just hit the plumbing section in your local hardware store. Here's one I made on my Accord feeding the stock airbox. Cost about $15. I'm sure you can do something similar to a Civic. When you paint it black it looks stock. I've been driving it all winter and no problems about water getting in.
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthr...&highlight=diy
http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...g?t=1258528906
http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...g?t=1258528973
http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...g?t=1258529029
^
Not bad. I like :)
hmmm.. its a pretty good idea infact, but being a pre-face civic (96-98), means we gotta think alot harder how to route the air into the air box, being only one source of getting air, the wide mouth, which is consumed by the rad an air con rad
Yeah, big pain in the ass I was looking at it the other day. Maybe 1/2 size radiator and move it over to the right enough for a CAI feed? lol
if you have an eg and have a RH foglight, remove it ;) and have your CAI sitting proud there - in honesty you hardly use your foggies anyways so not loosing much by not haiving it there
hahahaha, moving the rad, that kinda defeats the purpose of a cheap solution, considering itll cost to fab custom brackets, lol
heyy matee, im not sure if it'll work on the 96 - 98 model civics, but on my 94 civic i got a pipe off a BA falcon from the wreckers for 5 bux (not sure exactly what the pipe was used for on the BA loll).. the pipe leads straight to where the airbox used to be and on the end i connected an intercooler pipe which leads into the bumper with a pod filter on the end.. fits pretty neat imo.. but yeahh, it gets rid of the airbox!loll