[solved] Need help, car heats up on VTEC! But only on very hard runs!

Car: ek4
Engine: B16a

Basically when ever I go for a nice long drive say through the national park, the car will eventually overheat to the point where the temp needle will be only a few bars from H!!

But this only happens if I spend alot of time above 5600rpm (on VTEC!)

And heres the thing, when it heats up I just back off the gas and if I stay off VTEC as in shift before 5500rpm the needle won't budge from it's usual position and this is with 20mins of hard driving just below 5500rpm.

This doesn't happen when I hit VTEC during daily driving eg: VTEC in 1st 2nd and 3rd, then drive normal ans the repeat, needle doesn't move! But as soon as I got for a long drive hard drive and start hitting VTEC too much OMG the needle starts creeping up!

Have recently replaced thermostat with genuine Honda one.

Also replaced radiator with dual core aluminum radiator and flushed the coolant.

Car has aftermarket cams and cam gears and VTEC does come on pretty aggressively, what I'm suspecting is that the change in power output from off to on VTEC is so big that engine gets really hot really fast and stock Honda thermostat can't keep up?

Will getting after market low temp thermostat help? Coz it kinda sounds like an over heating issue which others would only normally face on a track day..

Or is my problem elsewhere?

Note: car does not suffer from any other over heating symptoms eg it can sit idle for 10 years as still be fine, problem is of I spend too much time above 5600rpm!!

Solution: Replaced Headgasket, installed ARP studs

problem is honda dont have accurate temp gauge that gives on the fly reading.
lags like mofo. and you probably only have single core half size radiator.

edit: you have dual core alu rad.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EG52NV

Car: ek4
Engine: B16a

Basically when ever I go for a nice long drive say through the national park, the car will eventually overheat to the point where the temp needle will be only a few bars from H!!

But this only happens if I spend alot of time above 5600rpm (on VTEC!)

And heres the thing, when it heats up I just back off the gas and if I stay off VTEC as in shift before 5500rpm the needle won't budge from it's usual position and this is with 20mins of hard driving just below 5500rpm.

This doesn't happen when I hit VTEC during daily driving eg: VTEC in 1st 2nd and 3rd, then drive normal ans the repeat, needle doesn't move! But as soon as I got for a long drive hard drive and start hitting VTEC too much OMG the needle starts creeping up!

Have recently replaced thermostat with genuine Honda one.

Also replaced radiator with dual core aluminum radiator and flushed the coolant.

Car has aftermarket cams and cam gears and VTEC does come on pretty aggressively, what I'm suspecting is that the change in power output from off to on VTEC is so big that engine gets really hot really fast and stock Honda thermostat can't keep up?

Will getting after market low temp thermostat help? Coz it kinda sounds like an over heating issue which others would only normally face on a track day..

Or is my problem elsewhere?

Note: car does not suffer from any other over heating symptoms eg it can sit idle for 10 years as still be fine, problem is of I spend too much time above 5600rpm!!

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sounds normal, push your car, it heats up.

Are you losing coolant?

what radiator? did you get a new one, second hand, brand, bought from where....

the biggest test is if your car can sit forever idling........

if it can idle forever, then its fine....

Engines that run lean, run hot! Could that be your issue?

Coolant is getting so hot it bubbling out of overflow bottle!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Touge Tom

Engines that run lean, run hot! Could that be your issue?

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Car runs overly rich IMO but can't say for sure Coz don't have air fuel gauge

Looks like car is juat getting hot coz its being pushed, and my last option is investing in a low temp thermostat to move the hot coolant out of the block sooner!

But aren't these bad for daily driven cars?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EG52NV

Looks like car is juat getting hot coz its being pushed, and my last option is investing in a low temp thermostat to move the hot coolant out of the block sooner!

But aren't these bad for daily driven cars?

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its bad for cars without a programmable ecu.

Just run no thermostat!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tiksie

Just run no thermostat!

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Lol car actually had no thermostat when I first bought it and man was it a bitch to get it warmed up!!! Even after a 15 min local commute I'd still have no VTEC Coz needle wouldn't even rise from cold position! With no VTEC I might as well buy a Hyundai lol

Any feedback from those out there running a low temp thermostat in their daily cars!

I agry, no thermo is shite

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EG52NV

Looks like car is juat getting hot coz its being pushed, and my last option is investing in a low temp thermostat to move the hot coolant out of the block sooner!

But aren't these bad for daily driven cars?

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Na low temp thermostats are fine as long as you don’t get one with an extremely low opening point..
Stock B16/18 open at 87-90c from memory, just get a 87c or 82c unit if you’re worried but they go all the way down to 65c I think.
Sounds head gasket related to me and possibly why the previous owner ran without a thermostat :(

Bubbling out of overflow bottle can point to a leak/break in the head gasket between the blocks water pipes and one of the cylinders... this type of leak can sometimes only show-up after long driving due to heat soak/build-up and not show-up on small runs even if you hit it hard.
This type of leak pushed hot air from the cylinders into the cooling system and does two things.. one, added heat and two, added air the cooling system than needs to be pressurized to work correctly and thus pushed coolant into the overflow bottle

Things I’d do:

1. Get a low temp thermostats (82c)
2. Make sure your radiator fans connected and working correctly (if not working unplug the fans two pin socket from behind the thermostats and bridge two pins with a paperclip, this with trick the fans into running the whole time but it’s only a temp fix.
3. Make sure you don’t have too much coolant in your system, more water the better in fact.. 10-20% coolant the rest plain water!
4. Make sure the radiator cups sealing and it’s the right pressure spring for your setup.
5. Check for leaks in the water hoses.
6. Maybe get a radiator pressure test a flush.
Remember the cooling system is designed to work under pressure and any leak or air bubble will affect its ability to work correctly and cooling efficacy

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tiksie

Just run no thermostat!

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Engines are designed and setup to run with-in a certain heat range for optimal performance and longevity, the cooling system needs to be configed to handle all the different variations.
Not running a thermostat means you actually have no control over the heat/cooling system and temps will fluctuate quite a bit, especially as it’s a daily driver and that’s bad.
Track cars can kind’a get away with no thermostat if needed as they’re being run hard the whole time and need to displace big heat, I’ve been told that it’s very hard to tune a car without a thermostat due to the big temp fluctuations I’ve just mentioned..

to me if your cars going fine with daily-driving under 5k-rpm then i would be considering changing your radiator, or at least get it pressure tested in the car.

I have a B16a in my CRX and it always ran stupidly cold, after a year of having i finally checked the thermostat and it was stuck open, got my radiator checked and it had a cracked core, possibly due to the faulty thermostat.

Just my 2c

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bboyzell

to me if your cars going fine with daily-driving under 5k-rpm then i would be considering changing your radiator, or at least get it pressure tested in the car.

I have a B16a in my CRX and it always ran stupidly cold, after a year of having i finally checked the thermostat and it was stuck open, got my radiator checked and it had a cracked core, possibly due to the faulty thermostat.

Just my 2c

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Dude.. Dont you read? It's a brand new dual core aluminum radiator from eBay.. Same problem occurred when I had stock EK4 radiator which is why I changed it..

As above poster has stated it's probably leaking HG and only occurs due heat soak...

I'll look into low temp thermostat as a temp fix as I save for HG change

you know, that might be your problem.

the new radiator..

lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EG52NV

Dude.. Dont you read? It's a brand new dual core aluminum radiator from eBay.. Same problem occurred when I had stock EK4 radiator which is why I changed it..

As above poster has stated it's probably leaking HG and only occurs due heat soak...

I'll look into low temp thermostat as a temp fix as I save for HG change

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Just make sure you get some tests done before you put her in for a HG

I had this problem with my D16Y1 took her to Hannys and they confirmed it was the HG and they changed it and all was good after that :)

Some idiot reported my above post.. man up and post your opinion!!!!!!!!

I had the same issue, but it was my radiator rusting from the inside, the previous owner ran just water according to my mechanic that what started the rust ~ personally i think it was me not giving a shit about the car for 6 months and letting sit in the sun lol. After i changed the piping + new radiator oem fixed the problem for me. A temp fix for me was constant flushing of my radiator till i was able to get a new one.

Probs not same problem for you, just finished reading the other responses. Meh just wat i exp'd could help.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bludger

you know, that might be your problem.

the new radiator..

lol

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Man of it occurred with the stock ek4 radiator and new radiator, the problem has got to be else where unless I have really bad luck and my brand new radiator is just as blocked as stock one bit hardly doubt it

Well, I would say BHG is plausible.....

if you rule out the radiator...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bludger

Well, I would say BHG is plausible.....

if you rule out the radiator...

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Yep, car started to heat up during idle when air con was on... dropped it off $550 later cars got a new HG as the other one was not blown but leaking... case closed

$550 is cheap for a new head gasket ! Thought it would be over 1k

Thanks for updating with conclusion

550 lol who did a hg for that much cheap as

Hannys did my HG for 480 D!6 though is B16 might be a bit more

Good Peformance Centre yenora did my head gasket.

I assume coz it's twin cam there's prob more parts to take out hence why it's more exy then the D16 HG? Actually it's prob also coz the price to purchase the Bseries Head gasket cost more from Honda then a D series HG.

In generl I'd say prices are pretty similar between Hanny's and GPC, I just go GPC coz its closer to home, and closer to train station and the guys there are a crack up!

I too was expecting $1000! What a relief!!

service manual specified that you need to use new head bolts.
for $550 i doubt they use new head bolts when it cost $15 i think each from honda.
new gasket itself i think it was $70 from US.

thanks for the update!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mocchi

service manual specified that you need to use new head bolts.
for $550 i doubt they use new head bolts when it cost $15 i think each from honda.
new gasket itself i think it was $70 from US.

thanks for the update!

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you don't need new head bolts man.

Its a good idea but. They can stretch as the head lifts. You can buy a full set of aftermarket ones for about 70 bucks.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

Lol... No doubt a quality head service was included..
Not!

Normally when you get your car repaired, you also address the root cause.
& you haven't done that. Don't be surprised when it fails again.

My receipt says head was sent away and serviced. Any probs than it's their prob..

Your invoice says that but there is no way in high hell your head was serviced for that price. Absolutely none.

lol ^

location : adelaide...

not sure if srs

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Photonic_Si

Your invoice says that but there is no way in high hell your head was serviced for that price. Absolutely none.

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It's cheaper to work on cars in NSW?

This is the car youre selling?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EKVTIR-T

This is the car youre selling?

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Yeah man same car, over heating issue has been rectified and fully tested.

Funny story tho, moochi was right, the original studs should have been replaced and weren't and because they had stretched the new head gasket failed after 2 weeks :( GPC put in a 2nd head gasket and this time we went with a set of ARP head studs. Car has been fully cold and hot tested. Cooling system pressure tested as well as compression tested.

Passed 100%. I then even tested it on "private" national park track lol and yes everything is a1.

Not trying to flog off a broken car people...

But moral of the story is, if you don't have ARP head studs, every-time you do a head gasket change, change your bloody head studs!

you must have abused the shit out the motor while it was overheating to have the head bolts stretch.

I've reused headbolts a few times and have never had troubles.

What are those other reasons? Keen for some learning

probably didnt use torque wrench / didnt look service manual for torquing sequence/reading. over torqued and stretched bolts.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EG52NV

Great info here Guise...

Well today must be useless comment day...

Let me have go... You must have a vagina because I pee standing up??

Mate way to go commenting on how "someone else" treats their car without ever meet the person or worked on the car...

Anyone one who has even a small amount of knowledge on cars can tell you there's is more than one reason head bolts can stretch....

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thanks for having a cheap shot.

I wasn't having a go @ you btw.
I was assuming that you had no idea that your car had head gasket issues while you were enjoying your long drive through national park, all the while spending a lot of time on vtec above 5600rpm.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EG52NV

Basically when ever I go for a nice long drive say through the national park, the car will eventually overheat to the point where the temp needle will be only a few bars from H!!

But this only happens if I spend alot of time above 5600rpm (on VTEC!)

And heres the thing, when it heats up I just back off the gas and if I stay off VTEC as in shift before 5500rpm the needle won't budge from it's usual position and this is with 20mins of hard driving just below 5500rpm.

This doesn't happen when I hit VTEC during daily driving eg: VTEC in 1st 2nd and 3rd, then drive normal ans the repeat, needle doesn't move! But as soon as I got for a long drive hard drive and start hitting VTEC too much OMG the needle starts creeping up!

Note: car does not suffer from any other over heating symptoms eg it can sit idle for 10 years as still be fine, problem is of I spend too much time above 5600rpm!!

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If @ the 1st sign of overheating.....

you baby it home and look for the cause.....

headbolts probably wouldn't have stretched.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bludger

sounds normal, push your car, it heats up.

Are you losing coolant?

what radiator? did you get a new one, second hand, brand, bought from where....

the biggest test is if your car can sit forever idling........

if it can idle forever, then its fine....

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this is bad information.

my bad.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bludger

this is bad information.

my bad.

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negged

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bludger

this is bad information.

my bad.

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that is very misleading mate...

Simmy's version of the event... Funny guy..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by simmy

when youre at

http://us.123rf.com/400wm/400/400/zh...to-nowhere.jpg

you drive
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/customa...tar21979_2.gif
What goes BBAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA after 5600rpm?

then it goes

http://www.diymyride.com/wp-content/...ture-guage.jpg

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solved??

how was it fixed?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lilthug

solved??

how was it fixed?

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Do some reading above and you shall know

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lilthug

solved??

how was it fixed?

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l2read mate

negged

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EG52NV

Do some reading above and you shall know

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DAFUQ! got negged for above post! Quit abusing the system bitches!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EG52NV

DAFUQ! got negged for above post! Quit abusing the system bitches!

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lmao gaters gonna gate

http://www.damnlol.com/pics/759/f08c...668ab500a1.gif

thanks for updating with solution.
was the head gasket wasnt it