Not happy with suspension

I have an 05 standard Euro and I think there is something wrong with the suspension. When i got over humps too quickly the bottom of the front bumper hits the ground after the front wheels go over the hump. It is as if the front of the car is too heavy. does anyone else have this issue? the rear of the car seems a bit better. I have driven heaps of other (non sport) cars but never had this problem before.

Also, the body roll on the car seems to be excessive. when going around corners quickly the car does not feel flat and stable, instead it rolls so much that i feel to have to be hang onto the steering wheel to support myself.

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Originally Posted by Rendezvous

I have an 05 standard Euro and I think there is something wrong with the suspension. When i got over humps too quickly the bottom of the front bumper hits the ground after the front wheels go over the hump. It is as if the front of the car is too heavy. does anyone else have this issue? the rear of the car seems a bit better. I have driven heaps of other (non sport) cars but never had this problem before.

Also, the body roll on the car seems to be excessive. when going around corners quickly the car does not feel flat and stable, instead it rolls so much that i feel to have to be hang onto the steering wheel to support myself.

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Hi Rendezvous- when you say the car bottoms out - has it always done this on your car since new or is it just a recent occurence? I also presume the car is not lowered in any way? A bit more info will help.

The other thing is - when you say you go over bumps "too quickly" - what sort of speeds are we talking about here? If you have made a habit of taking speed humps agressively since the car was new you will kill the suspension very quickly. Do you live in an area where there are lots of speed humps? Accelerated wear will happen very fast if you are not careful over speed humps, especially if you need to travel over them every time you drive the car.

As for body roll - I notice you have had the car since 05 but you are only noticing a change now?

It all points to worn shocks. Your car is still under warranty - but like I said if you don't take speed humps at a reasonable speed you will kill the suspension - especially the front end.

hi yfin,

the suspension has always been like that since it was new so i highly doubt that suspension has worn out. Its not a recent occurrence. suspension is stock. I also have an 91 accord which i have owned for over 6 years but i dont have the problem of the car bottoming out with this car when i go through the speed humps quickly.
there are certain humps around my area that i can go over at 40km/hr and others that i can go over at 60km/hr (the smalls flat ones).
The 91 accord feels much more stable and has very little body roll, but then again it is a much lower car than the euro

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Originally Posted by Rendezvous

hi yfin,

the suspension has always been like that since it was new so i highly doubt that suspension has worn out. Its not a recent occurrence. suspension is stock. I also have an 91 accord which i have owned for over 6 years but i dont have the problem of the car bottoming out with this car when i go through the speed humps quickly.
there are certain humps around my area that i can go over at 40km/hr and others that i can go over at 60km/hr (the smalls flat ones).

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It is hard to compare two different Hondas in terms of suspension travel and factory height. It is worth your while taking the car either to the dealer for testing or to Pedders etc (who from what I have seen advertised offer free suspension tests).

I think you are going too fast over speed humps. You will get accelerated wear there is no doubt about it if you are doing 40-60kph over speed humps.

As for body roll - the stock car does roll the rear plenty when you tip it or throw it into a corner. A thicker sway bar helps this plenty as well as lowering the vehicle.

Body Roll - get a thicker rear sway bar or upgrade your suspension.

Bottom out - Check tyre pressure (I use 35psi) and go over speed bumps slower. Note than the Euro's front bumper is lower than a lot of cars which can cause scraping problems.

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Originally Posted by sodaz

Body Roll - get a thicker rear sway bar or upgrade your suspension.

Bottom out - Check tyre pressure (I use 35psi) and go over speed bumps slower. Note than the Euro's front bumper is lower than a lot of cars which can cause scraping problems.

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Agreed.Re:ft. bumper.My car is lowered(approx.35mm)and i've got to be carefull!

The bumper is low, and the springs on the Euro are not exactly very stiff.

Just looking through the threads, and I can't seem to pinpoint the problem with mine...

My 06 Euro has a similar problem (with stock suspension) ie. the bodyroll anyway...which I would expect.

What is confusing, is that If I'm travelling down the highway and hit a small Dip in the road doing say 80ks/hr, the car's suspension will soak it up fairly tightly but in a kind of 'circular motion' ???!!! (As opposed to a clean linear 'bound and re-bound' motion. The same will happen if I'm cornering and hit a dip in the road (which is scareyer cause the bodyroll kicks in also).

Sorry this description sounds vague....I was hoping I could get a bashing on the forum BEFORE I get one from the dealer! The car is still under warranty, but I was wondering if anyone else has had a similar problem with their stock setup?

The car has only done 18.5k's and has had this problem since new....which now I just cannot ignore. We don't thrash it over speed humps, nor over any dirt or badly potholed roads. My initial thought was a bad shocky, which is possibly not dampening as quickly as the other 3.

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance.

Speed humps are there for a reason.. try going slower..
The Euro has got a long overhang over the front bumper on top of the low bumper...
The springs are progressive rate built on the soft side for comfort and not hump jumping, not your everyday sports car :)

60kmh over the speed hump is considered speeding over it especially in a euro.

Do you have a stock kit on it as that will make it lower?

Euro suspension = very soft
I don't think it'll be bottoming out as the euro is a pretty sturdy car, i think your just not careful when you drive.

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Originally Posted by Monty77

Just looking through the threads, and I can't seem to pinpoint the problem with mine...

My 06 Euro has a similar problem (with stock suspension) ie. the bodyroll anyway...which I would expect.

What is confusing, is that If I'm travelling down the highway and hit a small Dip in the road doing say 80ks/hr, the car's suspension will soak it up fairly tightly but in a kind of 'circular motion' ???!!! (As opposed to a clean linear 'bound and re-bound' motion. The same will happen if I'm cornering and hit a dip in the road (which is scareyer cause the bodyroll kicks in also).

Sorry this description sounds vague....I was hoping I could get a bashing on the forum BEFORE I get one from the dealer! The car is still under warranty, but I was wondering if anyone else has had a similar problem with their stock setup?

The car has only done 18.5k's and has had this problem since new....which now I just cannot ignore. We don't thrash it over speed humps, nor over any dirt or badly potholed roads. My initial thought was a bad shocky, which is possibly not dampening as quickly as the other 3.

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance.

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Change the shocks and springs(ive got Bilsteins with Eibach springs) or get coilovers,the stock setup is too soft,i lasted 1000kms before i changed mine.

the stock spring is soft. but i feel its much better than new CIVIC stock spring.
sometimes, if u go speed pumb faster, u may heat the front bumper.
so, go speed pumb slower, it will be fine.
its happened to me twice, cuz i didnt slow down.
so slow down when u go speed pumb, its good for ur rims, tyres and suspension.

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Originally Posted by tony1234

Change the shocks and springs(ive got Bilsteins with Eibach springs) or get coilovers,the stock setup is too soft,i lasted 1000kms before i changed mine.

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Thanks Tony... I have already thought about it (and it may be the final result anyway) but the 'circular motion' bounce is a real strange one which is pointing me towards a manufacturer fault with the current setup.

I'm relatively happy with the firmness and handling of the vechicle as is. We generally crawl over any speed humps (and it's not noticeabe over them anyway) but is mainly evident as you're driving over the last dip/bump at the end of a bridge, or a raised highway rail crossing doing 80km or more.

What confuses me is that it will happen even if the bump/dip/rail crossing is totally perpendicular to the road. The car soaks it up, but 'bounces back to the left' a little rather than bouncing in a predictable straight line up-down. Kinda scarey when you're on a right hand bend when it happens! I just don't want to look like a total idiot (like I do now) when I expalin all this to the dealer :confused: Might just have to pull a wheel or two off, and look for obvious shocky oil leaks/loose components etc.....Cheers!

i wish i could so 10km over speed bumps lol, na before i changed my suspension i noticed that too because i was used to a lowered car before my euro the body roll was crazy i felt like i was sliding across my seat, its more a STOCK car kinda thing i dont thing honda will help u much in that manner, personaly i recommend coilover suspension even if u dont wanna lower it just the freedom of all the adjustments that if your willing to pay for they i know things r not cheap these days

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Originally Posted by Crapdaz

60kmh over the speed hump is considered speeding over it especially in a euro.....

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Aren't they called speed humps because you're supposed to speed over them? Otherwise they'd be called slow humps.

...Reminds me of the novel "Fahrenheit 451" set in a totalitarian regime where books are banned and "firemen" light fires with flame throwers to burn the books. At one point, one of the characters said that he'd heard once that "firemen" used to put out fires; which got him an incredulous response like "if they put out fires they wouldn't be called firemen".

Of course 60km/h over a slow hump is too fast. Now, if they were really called slow humps people would think you'd be talking about something completely different.

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Originally Posted by SPQR

Aren't they called speed humps because you're supposed to speed over them? Otherwise they'd be called slow humps.

...Reminds me of the novel "Fahrenheit 451" set in a totalitarian regime where books are banned and "firemen" light fires with flame throwers to burn the books. At one point, one of the characters said that he'd heard once that "firemen" used to put out fires; which got him an incredulous response like "if they put out fires they wouldn't be called firemen".

Of course 60km/h over a slow hump is too fast. Now, if they were really called slow humps people would think you'd be talking about something completely different.

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thanks for flaming, but you know what they are called.
and i am just restating the fact that he is going too fast over the speed hump (to reduce speed as i dont know if your being sarcastic or not) in comparison to the softness of the stock euro suspension.

Anyways, don't mean to get your hyped or anything.

Cheers,
Daz

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Originally Posted by SPQR

Aren't they called speed humps because you're supposed to speed over them? Otherwise they'd be called slow humps.

...Reminds me of the novel "Fahrenheit 451" set in a totalitarian regime where books are banned and "firemen" light fires with flame throwers to burn the books. At one point, one of the characters said that he'd heard once that "firemen" used to put out fires; which got him an incredulous response like "if they put out fires they wouldn't be called firemen".

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LOL, reminds me of gun smith and black smith. So what does dick smith sell?

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Originally Posted by Monty77

Thanks Tony... I have already thought about it (and it may be the final result anyway) but the 'circular motion' bounce is a real strange one which is pointing me towards a manufacturer fault with the current setup.

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Get a wheel alignment done and find out your front toe, camber and castor. Sounds like you have the wheel on one side slightly ahead of the wheel on the other side, hence getting the circular bump, which should only happen if you are crossing a speed bump at an angle.

Dammit i put a post in about lift off oversteer, bald tyres, driver behavior, tyre pressure and stuff and the post timed out. It was GOLD i tell yas!

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Originally Posted by aaronng

LOL, reminds me of gun smith and black smith. So what does dick smith sell?

Get a wheel alignment done and find out your front toe, camber and castor. Sounds like you have the wheel on one side slightly ahead of the wheel on the other side, hence getting the circular bump, which should only happen if you are crossing a speed bump at an angle.

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Thanks Aaron. The wheel alignment was originally done by the dealer on delivery (well....really by beaurepaires) but what you said sounds very close to what I'm experiencing.
I should have given that a go first, just hoping there wasn't suspension changes needed beforehand. There is no visible oil leaks or loose components so it's likely a bad alignment right from the start...:mad:

Thanks for that mate...

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Originally Posted by Monty77

Thanks Aaron. The wheel alignment was originally done by the dealer on delivery (well....really by beaurepaires) but what you said sounds very close to what I'm experiencing.
I should have given that a go first, just hoping there wasn't suspension changes needed beforehand. There is no visible oil leaks or loose components so it's likely a bad alignment right from the start...:mad:

Thanks for that mate...

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Did you buy your car used? There were some Euro owners who complained about the car following the slant of cambered roads (although I think this is not a problem, more of the car's characteristic). The solution from the dealer was to adjust the subframe so that it is pointed slightly to the side to counteract it. You might have a car with an adjusted subframe. Just need to confirm it through the alignment printout, or you can get a mechanic to loosen the 4 subframe bolts and realign the subframe to the chassis through the 2 alignment holes. This should set it back to factory spec and all you need to do then is to get a front alignment done.

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Originally Posted by aaronng

Did you buy your car used? There were some Euro owners who complained about the car following the slant of cambered roads (although I think this is not a problem, more of the car's characteristic). The solution from the dealer was to adjust the subframe so that it is pointed slightly to the side to counteract it. You might have a car with an adjusted subframe. Just need to confirm it through the alignment printout, or you can get a mechanic to loosen the 4 subframe bolts and realign the subframe to the chassis through the 2 alignment holes. This should set it back to factory spec and all you need to do then is to get a front alignment done.

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No, I purchased it new, and I didn't get an alignment printout (as they do masses of Hondas for dealer pre-delivery) I have a good wheel aligner in Cairns (he is really fussy and pedantic with his work) so i'll take it to him I think. I will pick his brains though (on the details you mentioned).
Again, thanks for your help.

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Originally Posted by Monty77

No, I purchased it new, and I didn't get an alignment printout (as they do masses of Hondas for dealer pre-delivery) I have a good wheel aligner in Cairns (he is really fussy and pedantic with his work) so i'll take it to him I think. I will pick his brains though (on the details you mentioned).
Again, thanks for your help.

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Since you bought your car new, then I doubt that they would have adjusted your subframe. Just start with getting a wheel alignment printout first.

Aaron, whats the specs for a good alignment setup for the euro?

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Originally Posted by tron07

Aaron, whats the specs for a good alignment setup for the euro?

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What are you after? Straight line stability, increased steering response, mid-corner grip? Choose 1.

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Originally Posted by aaronng

What are you after? Straight line stability, increased steering response, mid-corner grip? Choose 1.

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aaron please state settings for all of the above. :p

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Originally Posted by Crapdaz

aaron please state settings for all of the above. :p

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These are my preferences, not gospel. So I'm sure someone has better settings out there.

Straight line stability (similar to stock alignment)
Front:
Toe: 1mm toe in on each side
Camber: 0
Rear:
Toe: 1mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

Increased steering response
Front:
Toe: -1mm toe out on each side
Camber: -0.5
Rear:
Toe: 0.5mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

Mid-corner grip
Front:
Toe: -0.5mm toe out on each side
Camber: -1.5
Rear:
Toe: 0.5mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

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Originally Posted by aaronng

These are my preferences, not gospel. So I'm sure someone has better settings out there.

Straight line stability (similar to stock alignment)
Front:
Toe: 1mm toe in on each side
Camber: 0
Rear:
Toe: 1mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

Increased steering response
Front:
Toe: -1mm toe out on each side
Camber: -0.5
Rear:
Toe: 0.5mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

Mid-corner grip
Front:
Toe: -0.5mm toe out on each side
Camber: -1.5
Rear:
Toe: 0.5mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

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gospel enough aaron. +1

in your opinion which do you prefer on the streets?

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Originally Posted by aaronng

Increased steering response
Front:
Toe: -1mm toe out on each side
Camber: -0.5
Rear:
Toe: 0.5mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

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Ive had this setting as recommended by aaronng and can confirm that the car has excellent turn in and cornering response. Speed Stability is superior to stock if you have the coilovers and RSB in my experience. Excellent setup!!

Well done aarrong and thank you.

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Originally Posted by Crapdaz

gospel enough aaron. +1

in your opinion which do you prefer on the streets?

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I currently have:
Front:
Toe: -0.5mm toe out on each side
Camber: 0
Rear:
Toe: 0.5mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

It's good enough for the street, although I have to be extra alert to keep the steering wheel straight at 110km/h because a groove in the road can pull my car to the side. I am going to add -1.5 negative camber up front soon. :p

Quote:

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Originally Posted by aaronng

These are my preferences, not gospel. So I'm sure someone has better settings out there.

Straight line stability (similar to stock alignment)
Front:
Toe: 1mm toe in on each side
Camber: 0
Rear:
Toe: 1mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

Increased steering response
Front:
Toe: -1mm toe out on each side
Camber: -0.5
Rear:
Toe: 0.5mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

Mid-corner grip
Front:
Toe: -0.5mm toe out on each side
Camber: -1.5
Rear:
Toe: 0.5mm toe in on each side
Camber: -1

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I probably would not bother about mid-corner grip, but more concern about straight line stability and steering response.

I am planing to get Hesman Steering to do alignment on my car soon, and want to get some reference points for comparision sake.

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Originally Posted by SPQR

Aren't they called speed humps because you're supposed to speed over them? Otherwise they'd be called slow humps.

...Reminds me of the novel "Fahrenheit 451" set in a totalitarian regime where books are banned and "firemen" light fires with flame throwers to burn the books. At one point, one of the characters said that he'd heard once that "firemen" used to put out fires; which got him an incredulous response like "if they put out fires they wouldn't be called firemen".

Of course 60km/h over a slow hump is too fast. Now, if they were really called slow humps people would think you'd be talking about something completely different.

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Originally Posted by Crapdaz

thanks for flaming, but you know what they are called.
and i am just restating the fact that he is going too fast over the speed hump (to reduce speed as i dont know if your being sarcastic or not) in comparison to the softness of the stock euro suspension.

Anyways, don't mean to get your hyped or anything.

Cheers,
Daz

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lol. Actually Crapdaz, I was having a go at the English language. What does Dick Smith do? Slow humps can be fun too.