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hey i was wondering if its possible to mix coilovers of a different rating or springs on the same damper.
for example.
Tein HA front damper + spring(10) with Tein Flex Rear damper + spring (5)
or even
Tein HA damper front and rear but with spring rating of 10 at front but Tein SS spring or a softer spring at the rear?
reason i ask is because Tein HA for the rear of the car feels a little too hard for my liking and i want it to be softer
Shouldn't be a problem.
u can mix match anything coil over u want champ ;)
then get different/custom springs for teh coilover ? rather than buy TWO sets of coilovers lol
w00ps ! edit: this is zico. wanna buy mine ?
ah so its safe huh.
well i was thinking using flex at the rear. or could i even use say tein S springs with HA damper?
mix and match for perfection ;)
may create unpredictable handling. going softer in the rear will probably promote more under steer.(some one please correct me I'm speaking from memory)Quote:
Originally Posted by EK4R
what are the current spring rates?
It might be better to go softer all round rather than going a lot softer in the rear.
better going with custom springs rather than going for off the shelf items.
^^. im using HA atm. and i believe they are 10-8 ?? or is it 8-6...its jap spec. im thinking to go 10-5
after consulting one of my stock car design books. (sorry only speedway tech manuals in the house)
running the rear too soft will promote understeer. which i guess is a lot safer than oversteer(running the rear too hard)
I think you will find the car not as sharp in the corners but i assume that you want to do this for comfort reasons.
i would probably have a set of springs made and see how you like it. i wouldn't go out and buy new dampeners for the rear as its expensive and you wont see much difference between the two. a drop in spring rate by 3kg will be dramatic enough.
how is the car handling at the moment? lowering the rear spring rates you are going to dramatically increase the amount of understeer you experience while cornering.
i tried to dig around for info about HA spring rates but as they are no longer in the tein line up its hard to find any info about specs. i did find a reference to 10kg/mm front spring rates but I'm unsure if this was the standard.
as long as your happy with a dramatic increase in understeer and you don't track/drive too aggressively you probably wont have a problem.
you wont be able to hold as much speed as you used to while cornering. The car will just go straight ahead into the gutter/cliff face/guardrail.
i'd be more inclined to get oversteer rather then understeer. At least with oversteer you're front wheels still have some use. (you can always point your way out of the corner and power out), whereas with understeer you've got less options.
As for mixing and matching, if you've got the same on the front two and and a different set on the rear you should be fine.
Don't go putting a D2 at the front left, a tein at the front right, Buddy club rear left and K-sport rear right. That'd be messy.
In a FWD understeer will always be safer and more controllable than oversteer - mind you , are we talking of actual on-power oversteer , OR weight shifting oversteer ? (lift off etc).Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonGilholme
The main time you'll get oversteer or understeer in a car is at turn in and quite frankly i'd rather have a little bit of over steer rather then understeer at this point cause you'll always have the drive and steering input from the front wheels to pull you round the corner.
If you get understeer you won't be able to turn or power out you just gotta try to slow the car down until traction becomes available again. Which could be too late if you've already gone off the track or over the edge of a cliff.
As for on power or lift off (weight transfer) oversteer. Its more likely to be weight transfer oversteer.
You're more likely to get understeer due to power rather then oversteer in a FWD car.
I guess it come down to individual driving techniques and styles.
Manufacturers always promote understeer in their cars from the factory. This is because in a cornering situation (ie understeer or oversteer), people panic and respond by automatically hit the brakes. in an understeer situation this ok as the car slows grip returns to the front wheels and you regain steering control. in a oversteer situation you hit the brakes the a chance you could spin the car losing even more control. Its a way of idiot proofing the car so people don't put it backwards through someones fence.Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonGilholme
yes a more advanced driver will know in a oversteer situation how to control it. but for normal people understeer is safer.
:thumbsup: I agree totally.Quote:
Originally Posted by CTR Coupe
in all - its common sense to promote understeer bias in this forum dont you think ? :wave:Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonGilholme
Id rather have the front end start to go wide and have time to correct throttle , than the back end snap out under lift off and just hope to catch it with opposite lock n gas.
It depends totally on the balance of the car. (swaybar setup)
It is just what i prefer.
lol ahh u guys thanks for the extra input. atm the car handles very well. but for comfort issues and daily driving im starting to get back pains....almost. so just want to soften up abit.
i had a look at other coils for eks and some are 11-3...so i think ill go 2-3 Kg ratings down for my rear and set my damper to harder setting instead. because atm my damper is on 0 and its already hard enough.
11-3?!?! what manufacture? i cant imagine that would be well balanced car. my spring rates are 4-3 and most coilovers are a max of 2.5-3.0kg difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by EK4R
yeah i totally understand about comfort for every day driving i would hate to be running 10-8 on a road but i would probably go softer all round rather than just decreasing the back keeping the balance of the car.
but like we have said its not going to be super dangerous or anything like that to step down in the rear. it will just upset your track/spirited driving with more understeer.
not sure. it was some ebay one and they said you can adjust your springs. anyways yea thanks for the feedback. im either sticking to HA or might go down to flex. i heard customs springs can be quiet costly?? anyone know? fork a little more and you can probably source some 2nd hand coils.
I wouldn't think they would be more than $400 for a set of 4. best investigate rather than assume. I'm looking at some harder springs made for my car haven't inquired about prices yet but i know where they do make springs here in Adelaide.Quote:
Originally Posted by EK4R
lets swap :)
EDIT: i was quoted 700 for 4 made by tein from BT-Revolution. and as for HA's...its discont so dunno if they have them anymore
If you're getting back pains i'd be looking at the seat more then the suspension.
The seat will be causeing the problem and the bouncing of the car will be making it noticeable to you.
good point :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonGilholme
ive founds STOCK seats to be terrible with lower/stiffer suspension.
You simply roll all over the place and its a hammering for your lower back and kidneys. You will event then be able to drive the car properly as you wont slide around mid corner too.
Get something like a nice recaro SR series or something off a higher spec model that suits your car ( CRX / DC2R / S2k etc)
10 front and 5 rear is too much difference in my opinion - you'll be see-sawing over every bump and as someone else mentioned you'll be under-steering liek a bitch !
With such a large differance in roll stiffnesses front and rear, the car will lose grip at the front wheels as everyones said, you will be reducing the front wheels grip in braking cornering and accelerating, especially when braking into a corner and accelerating out.
It will take grip from the front wheels during cornering, giving grip to the rear (by the ratio of weight transfered between the front L&R wheels, compared to the rear L&R wheels (due to the comparitive roll stiffnesses of the front and rear)).
This extra grip is completly useless at the rear of the car, it cant effectivly be used, as the fronts will be losing grip at a much earlier stage, meaning less availiable grip before the car losses traction.
The higher roll stiffness at the front, will cause more weight transfer between the front two wheels when cornering (ask if you dont know, and want to understand why), making front inside wheelspin on corner exit more of a problem.
As others have said its not really dangerous, its easy and predictable to control, but it will require you to drive at a decently slower rate particulary when cornering forces are involved.
With wet roads, your car will need to be driven carefully and slowly and IMO would be more dangerous due to the reduction of useable grip your vechicle can make use of, which you may very well need in an emergancy.
If you want to fix this problem, and not rob your car of its performance & saftey, you will need to increase the rear roll stiffness, compared to the front. You can do this using a thicker rear sway bar, or by removing you existing front swaybar. Or altering both in any way to get a good ballance, and level of overall roll stiffness to suit what you want.