DC5S gearbox woes

Hi folks,
Having an issue with my beloved 05 DC5S gearbox.

Sometimes when i shift to 3rd, the gear notches into place (instead of smoothly moving into 3rd in one hit), and other times I really need to force it into 3rd. It goes 90% of the way in, and then i really have to push it to get it in gear, where it finally clicks in (whilst my foot is still flat on the clutch).

The notch feeling is starting to rear it's head in 1st and 2nd, but i don't have to ramm it into gear.

Any ideas what this could be? I heard about the DC5R's having a similar issue in 1st..

Under what circumstances would warranty cover this?

Cheers,
Dan

if the car is still under manufacturers warranty then if possible take it back to the dealership it was originally purchased from (if possible) and let them know of your concern. that way they can have it on record that you were proactive about the problem rather than just take it there if (hopefully not of course) it does decide to brake completely. prevention better than cure remember :)

from previous experience working at a dealership they didn't look to kindly on cars that came back with broken gearboxes as they immediately assume they have been abused etc and try to void warranty on it

This also has happend to me a few times, but normally when lazy shifting and not applying much pressure, just push a little harder and it goes in. Not sure if its the same. I also get a unconfortable feeling in second. Went to Honda and they said its normal. Going to change tranny soon to see if that changes anything.

Try out Honda MTF 06. Fixed my gritty 2nd gear shifting.

i have the same problem with my dc5s, but it's definitely only in third gear at the moment and limited to revs ~5k+. I wasn't sure whether I should point it out at the next service. Usually it is when the car is cold though and it just takes a bit of "jiggling" of the gear stick. It can be really annoying though when trying to shift quickly and also when people who haven't driven the car before jump in. My car is due for a service pretty much now though so I might point it out knowing that other people have the same problem

I will be changing my MTF 06 within the next few weeks when i have time and keep you up to date. HATING the gritty second gear feeling ><!

This is a well known problem - it's all over the yankee sites. The fix is to change your gearbox oil to something a little bit better than Honda stuff.

I only just recently changed my trans oil to Redline MTF and it got rid of all of my gearbox problems instantly (I noticed on the second shift ie: third gear). I was having the exact problems you are describing.

Once you've changed it to a better oil, all you need to do to prevent this from happening is change your gearbox oil more regularly. As soon as you feel something notching or grinding again, change it.

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Originally Posted by Waggy

....Once you've changed it to a better oil, all you need to do to prevent this from happening is change your gearbox oil more regularly. As soon as you feel something notching or grinding again, change it.

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Approximately how often in your experience have you found it necessary to change the fluid?

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Originally Posted by T-onedc2

Approximately how often in your experience have you found it necessary to change the fluid?

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I've only recently bought my Type S... so I can't answer your question, sorry.

I've been told every 30,000-40,000kms is about where it needs another change, we'll see how the Redline goes (it's called MTL too, not MTF - my mistake) though, it's a full synthetic so it should be good for at least that many kms. At $128 a bottle locally, I'm in no hurry to change it.

mostly everyone has had this issue, the fix i had found to this is that, start ur engine and ppl normally say drive it for 5 minutes softly b4 any hard driving or anything but the actual fix to this is, start ur car and leave it there for 5-10 mins or until the needle moves up.

i found this had fixed all gear issues and everything. no more crunch, pop out, or anything.. so try it out.. it works :D

and driving it for 5 mins softly will do nothing.. so yeah :D

the reason it is graunchy is because u have most probably ever so slightly damaged your syncros. good fluid always helps and in most cases will sort the problem as discussed above :)

How often to change your fluid> well how long is a piece of string. It all depends on how hard you drive it... For example I know people who change there gear box and or diff fluid after every second race event... The harder its pushed, flat shifted, miss timed gear changed, raced etc etc the harder the fluid has to work and hence the more often you should change it. Ill expand on this.

With your gear box oil and the same with your engine oil... it is good to have a km limit, but the oil (and filter) should always be changed in accordence to how the engine is working. You might ask why should i change the oil at less the recommended km's? Well first you need to ask - what does the engine oil do.. clearly it lubricates but it also picks up deposits, micro particles and other nastie little goodies, at varying engine speeds temperatures etc - so there is a relationship between how hard your engine works and how hard your oil works to keep everything clean lubricated doing what its suppose to.

Now if u all enjoy driving your chosen honda as much as I do, you must surely put your car through its paces at different times and hence there are times where the fluid might need to be changed more frequently then others.

Some other things to think about - why does my gear box not have an oil filter?? - well no engine combustion so less of a need for a fliter as there are less deposits etc but what about that time i missed a gear - thats metal on metal people so there is now micro particals of metal through my gear oil (or worse) that cant be good for the bearings now can it...

Change your oil filter every time u change your oil

Turbo'd cars work harder so need a more frequent oil change...

Your car will last really only as well as u look after it - its not so much of a problem for standard cars.. but if you build one you put alot of money into it putting the best bits into it... so why not look after it wiht the best fluids.

Just to give u an idea...
My brothers street driven 300kw circut/drag evo3 gets motul fully synthetic gear oil for transfer case, gear box and rear diff about every 1000km, at 130$ per change apexi oil filter at 36$ and motul fully sythetic engine oil every 3-5 thousand km depending on how its driven at about 130$ per 4l
.

Some people might not agree with this post - that is fine - you can keep your hating to yourself, this post was designed to stir some thought with those who want to learn from the experience of myself and of a few others who have spent 10,000's on driveline and engines alone, and this experience has taught me otherwise!:)

DC5's have a defect in the 6-speed gearbox where the shift into 2 or 3rd gear is crunchy. The TSB in the US is to change the synchros, if I remember correctly.

MTF06 has the same part number as the MTF plus, but it comes from a different supplier (Australia instead of USA). I suspect that the place contracted to manufacture MTF06 uses a formulation closer to Redline since it did mask/fix my tranny grinding issue. Also, it is a different colour (grey instead of gold).

How bad is driving with this Gritty feeling in second and third for the gear box? I wont be able to change the tranny for quiet a while ><! hope its not doing too much dmg! FKN honda said its normal.

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Originally Posted by Zakarados

How bad is driving with this Gritty feeling in second and third for the gear box? I wont be able to change the tranny for quiet a while ><! hope its not doing too much dmg! FKN honda said its normal.

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Hi guys,

I am a new member to the forum.. i recently purchased a DC5s in immaculate condition with low k's, and i have to agree with the gear box issues! frustrating! i notice it more at lower rev gear changes - more so when the car is cold. I cant belive Honda have not recalled this model to address the issue.. disapointing, i expected better!

other issues ive noticed is that the engine mounts are rubbish!!!!! also, when accelerating through the mid range and into the top end i feel a vibration through the gas peddle which i find annoying and unrefined.

i must say that i am very impressed with the stiffness of the chasis/suspension from factory!

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Originally Posted by xra83d

Hi guys,

I am a new member to the forum.. i recently purchased a DC5s in immaculate condition with low k's, and i have to agree with the gear box issues! frustrating! i notice it more at lower rev gear changes - more so when the car is cold. I cant belive Honda have not recalled this model to address the issue.. disapointing, i expected better!

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It is not a safety issue and hence won't be recalled.

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Originally Posted by xra83d

other issues ive noticed is that the engine mounts are rubbish!!!!! also, when accelerating through the mid range and into the top end i feel a vibration through the gas peddle which i find annoying and unrefined.

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Not the engine mounts fault. The vibration through the pedal could be through the throttle cable when you have it at WOT, which tensions the cable and the combination of high RPM sends vibrations through the cable. If it was the engine mounts transmitting the vibrations, you would feel it through the steering wheel and the seats as well as the whole cabin would be vibrating.

i wasnt relating the mounts issue to the vibration.. but what your saying does make sense.

i just feel that the mounts have a bit too much flex in them.. ideally they could have made them stiffer like the dc2r, but i guess the car would then be too raw!

overall i am very happy with it.. no car is perfect, and to me this is close enough to perfection:D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by xra83d

i wasnt relating the mounts issue to the vibration.. but what your saying does make sense.

i just feel that the mounts have a bit too much flex in them.. ideally they could have made them stiffer like the dc2r, but i guess the car would then be too raw!

overall i am very happy with it.. no car is perfect, and to me this is close enough to perfection:D

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True, the mounts are soft as they are geared towards comfort. But that is typical of newer cars which place focus on comfort eventhough they are sports/performance cars, making it easy to get wheelhop. On the plus side, there are a wide range of aftermarket solid mounts available.

I have no other issues with my DC5S at all, other than perhaps the seats sitting a bit high, but I can live with that.

Replacing synchros isn't exactly a cheap alternative and if it's in the design of the gearbox I'm gathering the new synchro will end up the same.

I know for a fact that Redline MTL works, I've tried it and it's an immeadiate fix. During cold starts, low rpm changes...everything. If you aren't happy with your 2nd/3rd gear change, buy this oil and replace your old fluid as soon as you can.

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Originally Posted by aaronng

True, the mounts are soft as they are geared towards comfort. But that is typical of newer cars which place focus on comfort eventhough they are sports/performance cars, making it easy to get wheelhop. On the plus side, there are a wide range of aftermarket solid mounts available.

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I bought the type s as i wanted a car that is good-as-is from factory.. seeing the mods others have done is tempting me to get back into the modifying scene :(

i ordered a replacement KnN panel filter today and next im thinking of upgrading to mugen engine mounts.. i wana keep this car looking as stock as possible with only a few minor mods..

i was looking at getting the Aluminium 6 spd type R g/knob.. do you think it would look out of place in the dc5s? would love to see a photo of it fitted if anyone can help

http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/1...alldoneup2.jpg

sld be the same

thanks for the extreme close up! lol

i was hoping to see the rest of the interior in the photo too!

cheers

i'll be chaning my gearbox oil in my typeS on tuesday with Honda MTF06, hope this will help solve my 3rd gear blockage issue as well.
will let you guys know..

also i would strongly suggest getting a magnetic drain bolt for the gearbox sump and engine sump.

I've also heard (yes, this is just hearsay at this stage) that changing the shift knob to something more weighty such as a J's/APC Titanium Shift Knob, or an OEM FD2R shift knob can assist with better changes.

How much does a Honda stealership charge for a bottle of MTF06?
I need some new g/b oil for my DA....

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Originally Posted by string

How much does a Honda stealership charge for a bottle of MTF06?
I need some new g/b oil for my DA....

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$15-18 is the regular price. Dealership should charge around the same.

That is incredibly cheap... I bought a 1L bottle of power steering fluid for only a few dollars less than that... Is that per litre? (no I can't call the dealership I don't have a phone book nor a phone)

Per litre. Most dealerships also have an email address. Probably try sending them an email. Otherwise, you can buy it from Hondwreck if you are in VIC or Mekong spares if you are in NSW.

Ok Folks,
So, I took the S back to Honda to check the gearbox. They did their test runs etc, checked pulleys, hydraulics etc... could not find an issue. They did some tightening up (not sure exactly what, but it was all external to the gearbox itself).. I was advised that due to double synchro's betw 2nd and 3rd gear it can sometimes be a bit tricky, but there doesn't seem to be an actual issue. They did recommend the next step to bleed the trans fluid and re-fill which I'm inclined to do sooner rather than later..

Anyone got any tips on how to do it without getting messy?

Cheers

Jackstands, oil tray and a folded piece of cardboard to divert the flow.

The 3rd gear issue seems to be a common one especially in the US RSX's.

Have you taken a look at replacing your shifter bushings?

See here for more info: http://forums.clubrsx.com/showthread.php?t=402112

Hi guys, I've got a DC2R and my gearbox blocks me out when trying to downshift into 2nd. Has anyone got this issue?
I just changed the the gearbox oil to Castrol VMX80 and this didn't help at all.
Also when I'm reversing and put then clutch in the gearbox bounds and locks up. Is my box shagged? Is it beyond a simple oil change.

It seems to be a standard complaint for the k series six speed trans. Best solution is to use castrol syntrax. Satisfied all my clients using this oil and fixes a lot of high rpm quickshift grinds. :thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by bungie77

i have the same problem with my dc5s, but it's definitely only in third gear at the moment and limited to revs ~5k+. I wasn't sure whether I should point it out at the next service. Usually it is when the car is cold though and it just takes a bit of "jiggling" of the gear stick. It can be really annoying though when trying to shift quickly and also when people who haven't driven the car before jump in. My car is due for a service pretty much now though so I might point it out knowing that other people have the same problem

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Why are you up around that rpm when the car is cold?

Also, what ids the recommende oil?
Use it, if it requires a GL-4, and you put in GL-5, or vice versa...theres a very good chance youll damage it!

Sometimes the additives in the oils can damage yellow metals, if the syncros are brass or anything else is brass it may pit the brass and start to degrade it,eventually leading to failure.