CU2 Audio upgrade desperately needed for Accord Euro CU2 Luxury

[WarrenM]

I bought a 2009 Euro Luxury a couple of weeks ago, assuming that the 10-speaker audio system would actually sound like music. My last car was a Mazda 6 Luxury Sports and its Bose system sounded good enough that I didn't feel the need to upgrade anything.

The sound system in the Euro Luxury leaves a lot to be desired. Can anyone tell me if the fundamental problem with it is the front end or the speakers? I hope it's the speakers, since that would mean that replacing the splits at the front with real splits, and replacing the centre speaker with a good quality 2-way would probably make me happy.

My musical taste tend toward intense classical - piano, solo guitar, concertos, large orchestral works, choral works, with the occasional pop, folk, jazz or rock thrown in for good measure.

If anyone has gone through this process, what did you end up using?

I've seen Hertz HSK 165 splits for crazy cheap on eBay - way way cheaper than other quality splits I have looked at - they had some really great reviews but I don't know how they would fare in my system and how good they are for classical. I don't know how beefy the amplification is in the Euro Lux system and I don't know how much these splits need to drive them properly.

What would be appropriate for the centre speaker, which looks like it is only 4"? Should I be putting a small coax in there? Or maybe just disconnect it altogether!

Should I bother replacing the speakers in the rear doors? Hertz DCX 165 coax if at all?

I assume there is no point in replacing the pair of full-range speakers in the rear shelf.

Is the shelf-mounted sub good enough to keep? - should I be looking to replace it, leave it as is, or box it more effectively?

Help please...

[NightKids]

If speakers are the problem then I recommend Polk Audio DB651 or JL Audio C2-650. You should be pretty satisfied with either one of those speakers.

[Simonnn]

I think the car you have is a CU2 euro, not a CL9. maybe clarify that first so people can better help you out!

[WarrenM]

I think the car you have is a CU2 euro, not a CL9. maybe clarify that first so people can better help you out!

Correct! CU2. Sorry for the confusion - I'll correct the original message

[JustRight]

Hi there WarrenM,

You might find these threads of mine from last year of interest:
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthr...peaker-upgrade

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthr...cessor-upgrade

This may be overkill for what you are wanting to spend, but if you are looking for a system to play largely Classical or Orchestral music styles then the standard Panasonic based system in the Accord CU2 leaves a LOT to be desired. I personally found the standard system to be far too bright and harsh and completely lacked warmth and decent bass. The equalisation is just all wrong, at least to my ears, and the factory all plastic speakers are just rubbish. In fact many users, including many here on OzHonda have had the standard speakers fail, many times!

My system is now based on all Focal speakers and 4 channel amplifier, with a Rockford Fosgate DSP to 'fix' the dreadful EQ of the standard system. I did not want to go the the extent of changing the factory Head Unit, and there are little to no options in that area anyway. It's a big job, but the result is well worth it if you love your music.

Cheers, and good luck.

[Fredoops]

Correct! CU2. Sorry for the confusion - I'll correct the original message

put a [CU2] in front of the thread title will clear it up.

[WarrenM]

Hi there WarrenM,

You might find these threads of mine from last year of interest:
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthr...peaker-upgrade

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthr...cessor-upgrade

This may be overkill for what you are wanting to spend, but if you are looking for a system to play largely Classical or Orchestral music styles then the standard Panasonic based system in the Accord CU2 leaves a LOT to be desired. I personally found the standard system to be far too bright and harsh and completely lacked warmth and decent bass. The equalisation is just all wrong, at least to my ears, and the factory all plastic speakers are just rubbish. In fact many users, including many here on OzHonda have had the standard speakers fail, many times!

My system is now based on all Focal speakers and 4 channel amplifier, with a Rockford Fosgate DSP to 'fix' the dreadful EQ of the standard system. I did not want to go the the extent of changing the factory Head Unit, and there are little to no options in that area anyway. It's a big job, but the result is well worth it if you love your music.

Cheers, and good luck.

Thanks for that. Very helpful! The connection diagram is terrific!

I don't have your budget but I have decided to do it properly, at least to some extent.

Here is my initial plan:

I've bought a pair of superseded Hertz HSK 165 splits for the front, for $110 delivered (really) and unless I have a sudden change of heart I'm getting a pair of Infinity 652i coax speakers for the rear doors, at, I hope, $77 delivered and leaving the rear, although the more I think about it the more sense it makes to use 2 sets of superseded HSK 165s since they are so ridiculously cheap and a pair of the Infinity 6.5" coax speakers in the rear shelf. What do you think?

Given that I do not have anything like the money for a DSP and a $500+ amp, what are my options for amplification and for taming the treble and upper midrange? I have no idea what different car amps are like. You might laugh, cringe or throw up your hands in despair, but I saw something on eBay which may be worth a look (or may be worth avoiding at every turn). A Chinese "pseudo brand" of PowerVox is being sold on eBay by a few importers. As shonky as the ads are (they talk in music power or some other meaningless measurement) the specs are actually OK if not particularly spectacular: 140W RMS per channel (4 channels driven, probably at 10% THD) but even if this translates to 35W RMS at a reasonable distortion reading, it would drive my speakers at the volumes I listen. This sells for $86 delivered from one supplier, $155 from another. Is there any point in trying an amp like this or am I just throwing away money?

There are also 2nd hand name-brand amps on eBay which look OK.

When you finally replaced your sub, where/how did you mount the new one? Having already modified your environment substantially, was the sub a massive improvement or just a modest one?

BTW, in my plans, I will be sound-deadening the front doors (at least).

Cheers, Warren

[JustRight]

Thanks for that. Very helpful! The connection diagram is terrific!

I don't have your budget but I have decided to do it properly, at least to some extent.

Here is my initial plan:

I've bought a pair of superseded Hertz HSK 165 splits for the front, for $110 delivered (really) and unless I have a sudden change of heart I'm getting a pair of Infinity 652i coax speakers for the rear doors, at, I hope, $77 delivered and leaving the rear, although the more I think about it the more sense it makes to use 2 sets of superseded HSK 165s since they are so ridiculously cheap and a pair of the Infinity 6.5" coax speakers in the rear shelf. What do you think?

Given that I do not have anything like the money for a DSP and a $500+ amp, what are my options for amplification and for taming the treble and upper midrange? I have no idea what different car amps are like. You might laugh, cringe or throw up your hands in despair, but I saw something on eBay which may be worth a look (or may be worth avoiding at every turn). A Chinese "pseudo brand" of PowerVox is being sold on eBay by a few importers. As shonky as the ads are (they talk in music power or some other meaningless measurement) the specs are actually OK if not particularly spectacular: 140W RMS per channel (4 channels driven, probably at 10% THD) but even if this translates to 35W RMS at a reasonable distortion reading, it would drive my speakers at the volumes I listen. This sells for $86 delivered from one supplier, $155 from another. Is there any point in trying an amp like this or am I just throwing away money?

There are also 2nd hand name-brand amps on eBay which look OK.

When you finally replaced your sub, where/how did you mount the new one? Having already modified your environment substantially, was the sub a massive improvement or just a modest one?

BTW, in my plans, I will be sound-deadening the front doors (at least).

Cheers, Warren

Hi Warren,

I'm afraid I have never had any faith in the Audio hardware for sale on e-bay. Some of it might be genuine, particularly second hand items. New stuff however, even brand name, are more often than not fakes and copies that can be of very poor quality.

I understand however that with a tight budget these e-bay items seem very attractive. For the amplifier though, I would suggest that you at least have a look at what Jaycar are offering for a 4 channel amp. You may find that their prices are comparable, and you get local support as well. Adequately driving the speakers is the secret to a great sounding system, so try to get an amp that can deliver at least the 'nominal' rating for your speakers.

Controlling the awful equalisation in the CU2 though is a much bigger problem. With some component splits it is possible to attenuate the output to the tweeters via a switch on the crossover. If that is not possible then you can get an attenuator that can help reduce the tweeters output. Once again Jaycar should be able to help with this. To see what the equalisation curve on the standard system is like have a look at the images of my PDA running the Rockford Fosgate software in this link: http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthr...cessor-upgrade The red line shows the standard EQ. You can see that is adds 3 to 5db between about 1k to 3kHz, then drops back to flat until about 5kHz where it takes off again with greater than +10db from about 10kHz and upwards!! No wonder it sounds so harsh.

I ran the system in my car for a while with just the Focal speakers and the tweeters set to their maximum attenuation, and still I found the sound way too bright and harsh. All you can do is suck it and see. I decided to incorporate the DSP because I simply could not get the system to sound warm enough for my liking. Subsequently I also added a separate sub-woofer which certainly resolved any lack of bass.

The new sub is a powered enclosure from Focal called a BombA 27V1. This pre-built system comes with its own amp so I was able to drive all my component splits from the Focal 4 channel, and the sub looks after itself. I mounted it using special tie-down straps directly behind the rear seats. It still leaves plenty of space in the rest of the boot.

The performance improvement was massive! Way better bottom end. I was able to stop trying to over drive the components with bass, trying to get them to fill in the lower frequencies. If you can stretch to a subwoofer I would certainly recommend it. The factory sub is damn near useless, and once you fit new spilts etc you probably won't be able to hear it anyway.

Hope this helps,
Cheers.

[WarrenM]

Hi Warren,

I'm afraid I have never had any faith in the Audio hardware for sale on e-bay. Some of it might be genuine, particularly second hand items. New stuff however, even brand name, are more often than not fakes and copies that can be of very poor quality.

You are not the first person to say this to me. Hertz HSK 165s are apparently among the most common Chinese knock-offs around. I had a quick chat with the dealer who sold me these. They are indeed genuine, with Hertz-confirmed serial numbers. The current model has higher power handling as a result of a slightly different crossover, so old stock is being sold out by a couple of firms. Apart from checking serial numbers it is pretty difficult to tell the real ones from the knock-offs.

I understand however that with a tight budget these e-bay items seem very attractive. For the amplifier though, I would suggest that you at least have a look at what Jaycar are offering for a 4 channel amp. You may find that their prices are comparable, and you get local support as well. Adequately driving the speakers is the secret to a great sounding system, so try to get an amp that can deliver at least the 'nominal' rating for your speakers.

Controlling the awful equalisation in the CU2 though is a much bigger problem. With some component splits it is possible to attenuate the output to the tweeters via a switch on the crossover. If that is not possible then you can get an attenuator that can help reduce the tweeters output. Once again Jaycar should be able to help with this.

The HSK 165s have a +2/-2 adjustment on the tweeter. Sounds like that is nowhere near enough.

To see what the equalisation curve on the standard system is like have a look at the images of my PDA running the Rockford Fosgate software in this link: http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthr...cessor-upgrade The red line shows the standard EQ. You can see that is adds 3 to 5db between about 1k to 3kHz, then drops back to flat until about 5kHz where it takes off again with greater than +10db from about 10kHz and upwards!! No wonder it sounds so harsh.

It is hard to believe they have done such a crappy job!

I ran the system in my car for a while with just the Focal speakers and the tweeters set to their maximum attenuation, and still I found the sound way too bright and harsh. All you can do is suck it and see. I decided to incorporate the DSP because I simply could not get the system to sound warm enough for my liking.

I wonder whether there is such a thing as a poor man's DSP out there?

Subsequently I also added a separate sub-woofer which certainly resolved any lack of bass. The new sub is a powered enclosure from Focal called a BombA 27V1. This pre-built system comes with its own amp so I was able to drive all my component splits from the Focal 4 channel, and the sub looks after itself. I mounted it using special tie-down straps directly behind the rear seats. It still leaves plenty of space in the rest of the boot.

The performance improvement was massive! Way better bottom end. I was able to stop trying to over drive the components with bass, trying to get them to fill in the lower frequencies. If you can stretch to a subwoofer I would certainly recommend it. The factory sub is damn near useless, and once you fit new spilts etc you probably won't be able to hear it anyway.

Hope this helps,
Cheers.

I have space considerations as we will take our car touring, with a lot of luggage. I'm surprised there are not more high quality 8" subs out there. In spite of the obvious limitations mounting the sub in the same place as the existing one (i.e. open in the rear), I'd be very happy to find an 8" long-throw sub and drive it with a gutsy 2nd-hand amp.

I've taken a note out of your book and just bought a PAC SOEM-4 Line Output Converter on US eBay.

Thanks, Warren

[androo]

Warren have you received the HSK 165's yet? Can you send me the link to the seller? Thanks man! That's an awesome price! I was looking for some last year and was prepared to pay the $300+ everyone was asking for them!

[WarrenM]

Warren have you received the HSK 165's yet? Can you send me the link to the seller? Thanks man! That's an awesome price! I was looking for some last year and was prepared to pay the $300+ everyone was asking for them!

I expect them tomorrow or Monday. Once I have them, I shall verify for myself that they are genuine, with Hertz in Italy. Then I'll give you the link.

Cheers, Warren.

[WarrenM]

I wonder whether there is such a thing as a poor man's DSP out there?

There may be! I'm probably going to get the JL Audio DSP which I can get from the US for a little under $300 delivered - looks pretty good. There is a SoundStream DSP which is much cheaper but weighs more so costs a lot more to ship, and anyway looks like it is much less effective than the JL Audio.

I think I'm going to end up with a Kenwood 8" sub as a direct replacement for the existing free-air sub, but maybe there are some more musical subs out there that I don't know about. I have not found another sub so far that works well in a free air environment, and I really don't want to go the path of an enclosure at this stage. I plan to line the boot with mass loaded vinyl to cut out road surface noise and improve the efficiency of the sub.

Cheers, Warren