[CL9]&[CU2] You got Automatic transmission? *you'll WANT to read this*

[Cla]

Since getting my magnefine filter installed I can definitely notice a difference in the colour of the fluid wiped off the dipstick when checking the levels. Still looks pretty much pristine after ~12 months of use (Honda DW1 fluid).

Where did you buy your filter from?

In order news, I purchased 12Qt's from the states on ebay. It was around $155ish delivered to the door. Honda was looking @ the $200 mark.

[Softcox]

I got mine from ebay seller "gvfront": MAGNEFINE 3/8" AUTO TRANS & POWERSTEERING FILTER, BRAND NEW 171032574060 * Price: AU $10.00.

I previously bought one from the US which was a rip off Raybestos one but that one is legit. Not sure if they're still available from that seller or not though.

[chuboy]

isnt there like 20% off at repco for car club members (roadside assist and the like)?

surely would be cheaper than buying from the above site.

Wasn't aware. But Nulon FS at SCA is $68/4L so it's more than 30% cheaper to buy online excluding postage.

Besides I have no car club membership.

[Rich]

Has anyone else had a problem with leaking Magnefine filters? I got a proper one (not Raybestos), the hose clamps are tighter than a drum yet it's still leaking somehow. It's on the right way too (arrows pointing towards the rear).

[Fredoops]

maybe you put the clamp on so tight you bent the casing causing the leak?

[ChaosMaster]

Just out of interest Freddy, what MTF would you recommend? I'm stuck between Redline MTF ML85, Royal Purple Syncromax and Amsoil MTF (I think both are 75w85/90 where as OEM is 75w80?)

Edit: Here's a VOA, if you can understand it
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1647529

[Fredoops]

I do that've any view on MTF actually, but m always: if in doubt, synthetic

[ChaosMaster]

I do that've any view on MTF actually, but m always: if in doubt, synthetic

I take that as "I don't have any view on MTF actually, but if always in doubt, go synthetic" ?

I guess either would. The only question is where to get. Amazon shipping works out $100 per quart......

[Fredoops]

Yep, if in doubt, synthetic.

And try this place, local
http://www.performancelub.com/

[MikeCl]

Please ignore this post if 5AT Pressure switches have already been discussed elsewhere. However a few other flaws are also highlighted.

NOTE this is for the V6 and not applicable to 4cyl 5AT as that transmission is internally different in a number of ways including valve body design, clutch overlap timing and shift logic.

For anyone running a 2003 to 2006 5AT, it is imperative that you change 3rd and 4th gear "pressure switch's" every 3 to 5 years. These switches have been confirmed as a major causes in the many conditions and design flaws that cause 3rd gear clutch packs to fail in the 5AT. It is also imperative that the trans filter is changed every 30,000 Km due to cooler circuit design flaws (fluid flow) that can lead to Torque convertor overheating. A valve body and TCU flaw with forced 4th to 2nd downshifts was reported years ago and can cause excessive 3rd gear clutch pack drag and accelerated wear, magnified greatly if easing up on the throttle as a change to 2nd happens.

This information is meant to make you aware of things not to do and not to scare anyone who drives a 5AT - just make it last by avoiding the pitfalls. There is no reason these transmissions can't go the distance if serviced correctly (not by the book or dealer schedule) and driven correctly.

Information is based on the Accord V6 5AT, however this transmission is used across a number of vehicles in the Honda range, including paddle shift models.

LINK - 5 Speed Automatic Transmission (http://www.brisdance.com/Honda/AutoTrans1.html)

[h-man04]

I've got a 2005 Euro auto with only 108,000 Kms on the clock. Yesterday on my way to work I noticed that the car won't change into 5th gear it was just holding forth gear. I changed my ATF only 3 months ago so I'm not sure if it's got anything to do with that. On the way home the car started to shift into 5th again, but I felt as it was still holding onto gears for too long. Anyone have any idea what maybe the issue or experienced something similar?

[08r3308]

Castrol transmax is now added on castrol website ok to use in cu2, also it is on their bottle as well.
Valvoline vs castrol?
Castrol has higher flash temp tho?
Comments

[smclaren]

Noooooo .... my 2006 Euro's (250k's) auto just started whining last week.

I did a tranny gear oil change (Honda dealer) when I bought it at $75k's. Don't think ATF change is any service since (I could be wronge ?)

The vehicle does mainly highway miles.

Any comments guys ? Too late for a ATF change to make a difference ?

Thanks in advance.

[Jasemas]

Its probably too late to save it

[Fredoops]

Op updated re: Jdm atf-z1 ultra

[Fredoops]

Updated re: changing solenoid switch

[Haanda]

One piece of info to add to this. Honda do not make their own oils. In fact no motor vehicle manufacturer does. (20 plus years in the Oil Industry in both manufacturing and marketing taught me this.) Their engineers work with the major oil company's, who have the necessary test labs etc to test how their oils measure up to the task of satisfactorily lubricating the automotive manufacturers equipment and then make changes to the blends as required. The automotive manufacturing company then puts out a tender for supplying lubricants with that auto manufacturers name on the container, for sale though their spare parts outlets. The tender winner then slaps that automotive manufacturers sticker on small containers of those oils that meet that automotive manufacturers specifications. For example, Shell has the Ferrari contract. (world wide)

In Australia, the company that currently has Honda's contract is....Caltex. So when you walk out of your local Honda Dealers spare parts section with either a 500ml, 1 litre or 5 litre container of "Honda Oil", it is in fact one of Caltex's Havoline range.

But does that mean that each and every Honda dealer uses Caltex oils across the board in their workshop?

In regards to what goes into the engine crankcase... No. But when it comes to more specialist applications, like the Auto tranny. Usually Yes.
I know that John Blair Honda in Prahan, Victoria, uses Fuchs oil for engine oil changes and the latest Caltex Havoline Tranny Fluid that meets Honda's ATF DW-1 Specs.

( I wrote the Caltex name down in the service log of my newly aquired Accord Euro, but as I write this, the wife is off driving around in it, so I will post the correct name later when I can get a hold of the car!)

You could probably get the stuff cheaper at your nearest Caltex Lubricants distributor, than buying the stuff with the Honda label on the container.
You can locate them here:

http://www.caltex.com.au/ProductsAndServices/Pages/Small%20to%20Medium%20Enterprise.aspx

Snoop around your nearest dealer and take note of the oil company name on the bulk oil drums they have in their workshop area. Or just ask the service manager directly, like I did.

[Fredoops]

Bingo: Honda engine oils used to have Havoline/Caltex cap (the star cap) on it

[AndrewRox22]

One piece of info to add to this. Honda do not make their own oils. In fact no motor vehicle manufacturer does. (20 plus years in the Oil Industry in both manufacturing and marketing taught me this.) Their engineers work with the major oil company's, who have the necessary test labs etc to test how their oils measure up to the task of satisfactorily lubricating the automotive manufacturers equipment and then make changes to the blends as required. The automotive manufacturing company then puts out a tender for supplying lubricants with that auto manufacturers name on the container, for sale though their spare parts outlets. The tender winner then slaps that automotive manufacturers sticker on small containers of those oils that meet that automotive manufacturers specifications. For example, Shell has the Ferrari contract. (world wide)

In Australia, the company that currently has Honda's contract is....Caltex. So when you walk out of your local Honda Dealers spare parts section with either a 500ml, 1 litre or 5 litre container of "Honda Oil", it is in fact one of Caltex's Havoline range.

But does that mean that each and every Honda dealer uses Caltex oils across the board in their workshop?

In regards to what goes into the engine crankcase... No. But when it comes to more specialist applications, like the Auto tranny. Usually Yes.
I know that John Blair Honda in Prahan, Victoria, uses Fuchs oil for engine oil changes and the latest Caltex Havoline Tranny Fluid that meets Honda's ATF DW-1 Specs.

( I wrote the Caltex name down in the service log of my newly aquired Accord Euro, but as I write this, the wife is off driving around in it, so I will post the correct name later when I can get a hold of the car!)

You could probably get the stuff cheaper at your nearest Caltex Lubricants distributor, than buying the stuff with the Honda label on the container.
You can locate them here:

http://www.caltex.com.au/ProductsAndServices/Pages/Small%20to%20Medium%20Enterprise.aspx

Snoop around your nearest dealer and take note of the oil company name on the bulk oil drums they have in their workshop area. Or just ask the service manager directly, like I did.

The supermarkets do the same things with their products.....
I noticed that Dave Potter honda in Adelaide had a Castrol invoice on their table when I went in to ask for spares...

Looked at Caltex's lube guide and it seems they have updated the ATF recommendation to the DW-1 equilvilant on all of their lube guides way before eveyone else so it kinda hints at them having more up to date info from Honda

I just find it a bit strange the engine oil recommendations are so thick 10W-30 or 15W-40 for my 03-08 Euro?!

Have never seen anywhere sell 5L bottles of Caltex oils though

Probabily going to stick to Penrite, it works well for me..... tempted to give their DW-1 alternative (Fully Synthetic LV) a shot despite it not being recommended yet

[Jasemas]

Caltex oil is Texaco Havoline AKA Chevron
Most of their oils do not meet API SN/SM specs
And doesn't really fill me with confidence
Penrite HPR5 (5w40) is the best!

[Haanda]

Caltex oil is Texaco Havoline AKA Chevron
Most of their oils do not meet API SN/SM specs
And doesn't really fill me with confidence
Penrite HPR5 (5w40) is the best!

Seeing that the Caltex parent company is Chevron, one of the world "Big 5" retail petroleum giants (being Shell, BP, Total S.A., Chevron and Exxon) I doubt very much that their modern products DO NOT meet sn/sm specs.

These are the companies that ARE the API and control the world retail oil market.

Some products are specifically meant for older engines etc, built before the sn spec (introduced in 2010) or sm spec (introduced in 2004) arrived on the scene, so the company's are not going to make all their products to meet those specs. (I also own a 1996 SAAB. No point in using sn or sm spec oil in that car. Ditto for anyone owning a Gen 5 Accord.) Just select the ones that do if your car was built after either of those dates.

The one thing that many do not pick up on is that the tightest refined oil specs laid down, are those of the US military. (Look for the "milspec" rating in any refined product spec sheet. That's what it refers to.)

All other small oil company's have some sort of link to one of these majors. R&D is costly and complex and they rely on information from the sophisticated R&D labs owned by the big 5 company's, that work hand in hand with the the senior engineers of the Development Engineering departments of the major automotive, marine and aerospace manufactures.
(Don't forget Jet Engine Manufacturers such as SNECMA , GE, Pratt and Whitney and Rolls Royce etc!)

For example, Castrol,--- 40% owned by Shell. Pennzoil--- 100% owned by Shell.

They either buy their base oils from refinery's owned by the big 5 and blend them themselves, or buy in bulk from the Big 5 and repackage in their own containers. (For example, in Victoria there is a well run, but minor oil company called APCO. All its products are sourced from Mobil.)

The last lubricating Oil Production plant in Australia was at the Shell Refinery in Geelong, Victoria. (It was one of only 2 Shell plants in the world that made the base oils for 100% fully Synthetic Oil, when that type of oil 1st appeared on the scene.) Shell closed that plant and demolished it some years ago and now all Lube Oil base oils sold here, are imported from Singapore and India, with a trickle from Europe and the USA. (Australian Bass Strait crude does not contain any crude oil heavy enough to be refined into base oils for Lube Oil.)

Penrite is a great oil with a very good name. If you feel comfortable using it, then continue to do so.

(BTW. If I was to tell you what the base product was for fully synthetic oil, many of you would shake your heads in disbelief.):eek:

[AndrewRox22]

@Jasemas Caltex products do have APIs so I dunno which oils you are referring to http://www.caltex.com.au/FPL%20PDS/Havoline%20Premium%20Plus.pdf but I can agree that there aren't many products better than Penrite or Nulon for the average user

@Haanda, do you have a source for these ownership examples you just stated? I find it hard to believe that Castrol (a BP brand) can be owned partically by Shell because BP is such a huge company themselves and they own many smaller ones. Buying some new packaged Shell oil recently, I saw that it all comes out of HK now

[Fredoops]

@Jasemas Caltex products do have APIs so I dunno which oils you are referring to http://www.caltex.com.au/FPL%20PDS/Havoline%20Premium%20Plus.pdf

Seeing that the Caltex parent company is Chevron, one of the world "Big 5" retail petroleum giants (being Shell, BP, Total S.A., Chevron and Exxon) I doubt very much that their modern products DO NOT meet sn/sm specs.

Jasemas is kinda right, the Honda FEO 10w30 is API SL, a 15 year old spec which is quite a bit inferior to SN or SM in terms of protection, You need the FEO ultra to get SM spec (old feo ultra is 5w30, it's now 10w30), which is still an 10 year old spec, SN is the "Latest" so to speak...

Which just means honda wants you to pay premium price for crap (more or less)

Now the USDM Honda full synthetic 5w20 is API SN.... Which is made by Diametsu (spell?)




(BTW. If I was to tell you what the base product was for fully synthetic oil, many of you would shake your heads in disbelief.):eek:

In Australia/USA group 3 base oil can be called fully synthetic, thanks to Castrol winning that lawsuit back in 1990's.

Group 3 is basically highly refined mineral oil....

In Europe however you'll need to be at least group 4 to be called synthetic.

Group 4 = PAO
Group 5 = Ester




NOW back to topic of ATF and Honda auto tranny, honda ATF-Z1 is bascially mineral base oil with a crap load of Zinc, ATF-DW1 is pretty much the same but thinner (except in canada, where they use a synthetic base....), the blend was reported as being not aluminium friendly at all.
No chance in hell im using Mineral base oil in a tranny for 80k km....

[Haanda]

Just to clarify ( as Freedopstates, this has gone way off topic ) Many of these majors enter Joint Ventures together. Yes, BP (UK) bought out Castrol some years ago, but during my time in the industry in this country, Castrol (Australia) was a 40/60 Shell/BP partnership, with Shell being the major base oil supplier. Of course, Shell (Australia) is now in fact 100% owned by Dutch/Swiss group "Vitol......" Lots of smoke and mirrors in the Oil game.

What I have been trying to point out though is that after reading through a US Honda forum and a Brit Mercedes forum, in both is a similar misconception that auto manufacturers make their own lube oils and that these are the "be all and end all of oils." Whereas individual dealer workshops actually use whatever brand of bulk oil they can get that meets the required specs, at the cheapest price!! Independent garages do the same thing and Valvoline ( now German owned) are very aggressive in supplying that latter market in this country.

And to endorse Freedops again, mineral oils in a tranny for 80,000 kms or more?.... No way! 20,000 kms has been and is still my limit. :)

[Haanda]

A question concerning the Auto Tranny filter in my 2012 Euro.

It took me a while to locate it ( directly under the fuse box in the rear of the engine bay on the passenger side) but it is in a vertical position, not lying horizontal like the photos I have seen of the way it is positioned in earlier models.
Can anyone advise me
1) if the Filter part no, as supplied on page 1 of this thread, applies to my model?
2) What the flow direction is? ("Up" or "Down")
Thanks in advance.

[Fredoops]

A question concerning the Auto Tranny filter in my 2012 Euro.

It took me a while to locate it ( directly under the fuse box in the rear of the engine bay on the passenger side) but it is in a vertical position, not lying horizontal like the photos I have seen of the way it is positioned in earlier models.
Can anyone advise me
1) if the Filter part no, as supplied on page 1 of this thread, applies to my model?
2) What the flow direction is? ("Up" or "Down")
Thanks in advance.

Look at the part diagram here:
http://www.oemacuraparts.com/auto-parts/2012/acura/tsx-sedan/tsx-se-trim/5-speed-automatic-engine/transmission-automatic-cat/at-oil-level-gauge-atf-pipe-l4-2-scat

It's item 5, and yes the filter part number is the same, as to where it flows... Just use the same place as when u take it out...

Ps those guys in US don't ship overseas, so try ebay instead.

[Haanda]

Thank you Fredoops. What a great resource!

I am fortunate in having a US Contact who often gets SAAB auto parts for me and ships them out. I am sure he can be charmed into obtaining Acura parts.
I have also used "Bongo" in the past successfully as well, for larger stuff, to get around US Shippers who only want to send to the "lower 48 states" etc.
See https://bongous.com/

[Fredoops]

It's a 20 dollar part, cheaper to get off ebay than do forward shipping unless you got other things that's coming anyway

[Haanda]

I buy SAAB service stuff in bulk from the US, because its cheaper, even with the shipping added in and our falling $ taken into consideration. A few Acura parts will join the next shipment (:
Thanks for all the Tranny info.
My Euro has to last me a while, (if I can ever get it off the wife!!) so already the info in this thread has proved very valuable.

[Haanda]

I reckon that installing a Magnefine Filter (3/8th fittings) in in my MY 12 Accord Euro 5 Speed Auto, in place of the Honda OEM part, is the way to go.

But once again, I ask which way is the flow direction on the genuine part? Looking at the OE style filter from side on, as per the attached photo, you can see that it is longer on one side of the raised lip on the casing, than it is the other.

On my vehicle, the filter is mounted vertical, not lying across the transmission case. The short side is underneath. The long side on the top. The hose it is in, runs between the pre heater and the transmission housing.

So can anyone advise which way does the fluid flow run? Down into the filter from above (FROM the pre heater TO the transmission) or up into the filter from below? (TO the pre heater FROM the transmission.)

Obviously the info is vital to ensure that if I fit a Magnefine filter, it is installed with the flow going in the correct direction.

Thanks in advance

[AndrewRox22]

I reckon that installing a Magnefine Filter (3/8th fittings) in in my MY 12 Accord Euro 5 Speed Auto, in place of the Honda OEM part, is the way to go.

But once again, I ask which way is the flow direction on the genuine part? Looking at the OE style filter from side on, as per the attached photo, you can see that it is longer on one side of the raised lip on the casing, than it is the other.

On my vehicle, the filter is mounted vertical, not lying across the transmission case. The short side is underneath. The long side on the top. The hose it is in, runs between the pre heater and the transmission housing.

So can anyone advise which way does the fluid flow run? Down into the filter from above (FROM the pre heater TO the transmission) or up into the filter from below? (TO the pre heater FROM the transmission.)

Obviously the info is vital to ensure that if I fit a Magnefine filter, it is installed with the flow going in the correct direction.

Thanks in advance

flow goes in the direction of the raised side, so in that picture you attached, it goes up

[Haanda]

Thank you AndrewRox22. So in my Euro, the flow will run from above (from the pre heater) to below (to the transmission casing.) That makes things quite clear.

[AndrewRox22]

yeah, it goes down with gravity (makes sense too)... looks like the new Accords and CRVs have the same setup http://postimg.org/image/67u5liatj/

[Haanda]

Here it is on my MY12. Buried deep in the rear of the engine bay, passenger side. Almost impossible to get a camera in there to get a clear photo. You can make out the top of it between the hose and the fuse box. The only way I could determine which way it was fitted, was by feel.

[Fredoops]

refer to the parts diagram, they're there to help.

[Haanda]

I did. That's how I knew what to look for. But actually getting at it is another thing. I reckon I will need a pair of telescopic arms! :) It's certainly a part that was fitted BEFORE the drive train assembly was put into the car body.

[BigBen]

It's a 15min job to do, unclip the clamps at the entry and exit of the pipes and not at the filter. Remove the whole assembly then it's easy to undo the filter. If the car has been warmed up the hoses becomes flexible and they can be easily undone.

[Haanda]

Thanks Big Ben. There is a hose in the way, ( I think part of the heater system) even if one wants to get to the clamp on the steel line that exits the preheater system.
The underside is also going to be an issue. ( Probably have to access it from underneath the car) But all hints and tips gratefully accepted.

[BigBen]

Stand at the passenger side and lean / dive into the engine bay. Rest your body onto the engine. Its super easy to do, once the clamps are off just twist the hose left and right until it comes loose. Put some rags around the area as some trans fluid will leak out.

[Haanda]

That I will be trying--- with a rug or something on the outer guards. (I just hope no one starts taking a video of me while I do that. It would look like a whale trying to hump a Honda! :o )

[AndrewRox22]

Hey guys, thinking of getting one of these for my trans and engine.... http://fumoto.com.au/info.htm

Anyone have the measurements for the transmission plug- I need the diameter of the plug and the pitch between threads? or using one to let me know which model they bought?

If anyone is about to do theirs, could you please measure?

[Jasemas]

But why though?
The plug for that transmssion as actually MAGNETIC
and you know kinda helps pick up floating shrapnel in your transmission - which would otherwise get into fragile bits and ruin them
They're fine for your ENGINE oil plug
But Honda engineered the AT plug with a magnetc FOR A REASON

[AndrewRox22]

But why though?
The plug for that transmssion as actually MAGNETIC


Ah right, slipped my mind that it was magnetic...

[Haanda]

I would have some concerns about putting one on the engine sump.
From experience, "Ball" valves, can ( and do) leak from the seal on either the ball over time.

[AndrewRox22]

I would have some concerns about putting one on the engine sump.
From experience, "Ball" valves, can ( and do) leak from the seal on either the ball over time.

yeah, I was worried about too but plenty of people on another forum and the makers claim that they havent had any issues on it yet with the amount they have sold...... tempted to throw the $40 at it to test but not sure

[Fredoops]

40 bucks buy a lot of magnetized sump plugs tho...

[AndrewRox22]

40 bucks buy a lot of magnetized sump plugs tho...

i guess I am drawn in for the convenience every 6 months.... do you have any you recommend that dont have the crappy weak magnets I see on ebay?

[Jasemas]

i guess I am drawn in for the convenience every 6 months.... do you have any you recommend that dont have the crappy weak magnets I see on ebay?

The OEM AT sump magnet is perfectly fine

I have a TEGIWA one in my engine sump
I heard spoon is good


Edit:
You must ne doing alot of kms to be changing the ATF that often

[AndrewRox22]

The OEM AT sump magnet is perfectly fine

I have a TEGIWA one in my engine sump
I heard spoon is good


Edit:
You must be doing alot of kms to be changing the ATF that often

any idea where i can source them? are they picking up much each service?

To be clear, i dont do a full flush every year (i.e fill 3 times and drain) I just drain as much as i can and replace that yearly

[RenzokukenJ]

so many caps

[Jasemas]

any idea where i can source them? are they picking up much each service?

To be clear, i dont do a full flush every year (i.e fill 3 times and drain) I just drain as much as i can and replace that yearly

http://www.tegiwaimports.com/

They pick up a little bit
But if there's alot on the plug i'd be worried / or its getting to the plug before it goes through the filter

[Haanda]

They won't leak when they are new. But over time, that nylon seal will only need to get a "groove" from a foreign particle, such as a small shaving of metal etc, and it will. In my previous line of work ( I am now retired) I dealt with this type of valve on a daily basis and eventually they all leaked.
But that could be after 5 or 6 years, or even 8 -10, but also conversely after 6-12 months. In 98% of cases, it was damage from foreign material that caused the leak.

[BigBen]

My Amsoil guy just dropped a box of 12 quarts of Amsoil ATF ATL - Low Viscosity ATF. Was disappointed how the Honda DW1 goes off so quickly.

Does anyone know if the Honda ECU learns how you drive and program the transmission accordingly, AKA like the Toyota ECUs?

Do I need to reset the ECU by disconnecting the battery?

28378

[AndrewRox22]

Does anyone know if the Honda ECU learns how you drive and program the transmission accordingly, AKA like the Toyota ECUs?

Do I need to reset the ECU by disconnecting the battery?

28378

nice, how much did it cost you?

I dont think the Honda system has this, my mother borrowed my car for a month while I was overseas and it drove the same when I got back...

The toyota system is a bit like a double edged knife... helpful if you consistantly drive the same but if your drive style varies/ someone else drives, it can feel like it's not sure what to do or react not as it should

[BigBen]

Its cost $200.00 including delivery, so a little bit more than the Honda DW1.

[08r3308]

Let us know how it goes. I been thinking going amsoil:)

Tried redline d4 now back to honda dw1

[Fredoops]

Let us know how it goes. I been thinking going amsoil:)

Tried redline d4 now back to honda dw1

You're not meant to use d4 for cu2.

You should be using a thinner d6 or something

[BigBen]

I've been sitting in crappy Sydney traffic lately. 2 Weeks ago it took almost 2 hours to travel 20km. In this driving conditions I've notice with the tranny on Honda DW1 is that it would not respond as precisely and hunts and shifts are slightly harsher - you can feel the difference. This is with a tranny with 30k on the current DW1 oil change (I do a 3 x 3 dump and pump plus in line filter change every 30k). In flowing traffic the transmission shift like its suppose to be. Bumper to bumper traffic is killer on the trans fluid so I can only assume the DW1 is breaking down due to constant heat stress.

[Haanda]

"Does anyone know if the Honda ECU learns how you drive and program the transmission accordingly, AKA like the Toyota ECUs?

Do I need to reset the ECU by disconnecting the battery?"



My wife and I often drive ours on the same day ( I drive it and then come home and then she takes it out and goes elsewhere). We both have different driving styles and the car feels no different after each individual drivers outing. So I would say " NO" to that question.

[Jasemas]

I've been sitting in crappy Sydney traffic lately. 2 Weeks ago it took almost 2 hours to travel 20km. In this driving conditions I've notice with the tranny on Honda DW1 is that it would not respond as precisely and hunts and shifts are slightly harsher - you can feel the difference. This is with a tranny with 30k on the current DW1 oil change (I do a 3 x 3 dump and pump plus in line filter change every 30k). In flowing traffic the transmission shift like its suppose to be. Bumper to bumper traffic is killer on the trans fluid so I can only assume the DW1 is breaking down due to constant heat stress.

Do you keep it in D4/D5 or sports mode in city traffice?
If you never go over 40km an hour
its best not to use 5th gear/over drive torque converter lock up
Best to stay within gears 1-4

[BigBen]

I usually leave it in D. The ECU does not allow you to manually shift via the flappy pedals into 5th gear below 50-60km/h anyway. I'll put the Amsoil ATL this afternoon when I get home the old tranny oil should be nice and hot by then!

[Jasemas]

I usually leave it in D. The ECU does not allow you to manually shift via the flappy pedals into 5th gear below 50-60km/h anyway. I'll put the Amsoil ATL this afternoon when I get home the old tranny oil should be nice and hot by then!


Nahh what i'm saying is
If you want your transmission to last longer
Keep it out of D4/D5 in city traffic/or if you never go over 60kmh

[RenzokukenJ]

I'm seeing so many D

Can't help but think di

Di

Di

Dic

Dictionary

[BigBen]

Just completed a 3 x 3 dump and pump and filter change with Amsoil ATL. Initial test drive is the tranny shifts are smooth like stock. Put it in sports mode and rowing through the gears via the paddle shifter, the gear changes feels positive no slip or sloppy at high revs. I could be comparing old fluid with new fluid but the tranny seems quieter. All I hear is the slight rumble of from the tyres. Pity the Euro does not have a temperature sensor in the tranny to compare old and new fluid temps.

All up I used 11 and a bit quarts of Amsoil ATL. The Honda DW1 at 30k km was really black, all the additives must be doing its job.

[Rich]

You're not meant to use d4 for cu2.

You should be using a thinner d6 or something
Might be good to clarify that on the first page. All it says is pre 2010 and all the oils are listed below with no post 2010 heading. My CU2 is MY09.

[Fredoops]

Might be good to clarify that on the first page. All it says is pre 2010 and all the oils are listed below with no post 2010 heading. My CU2 is MY09.

The 1st post says 2010 because that's when Honda's Service bulletin came out to make the move to DW1.

Pre-2010 had Z1 as factory fill.

[Rich]

The 1st post says 2010 because that's when Honda's Service bulletin came out to make the move to DW1.

Pre-2010 had Z1 as factory fill.
Yeah that was my interpretation. I was just thinking it could be misinterpreted and maybe that's what went down.

Given Honda now only supply DW1, would it be fair to say all models would be ok on the post 2010 alternative oils (Amsoil ATL & Redline D6)? Clearly post 2010 models shouldn't use the earlier, thinner oils.

[Fredoops]

Yeah that was my interpretation. I was just thinking it could be misinterpreted and maybe that's what went down.

Given Honda now only supply DW1, would it be fair to say all models would be ok on the post 2010 alternative oils (Amsoil ATL & Redline D6)? Clearly post 2010 models shouldn't use the earlier, thinner oils.

The earlier atf were thicker.

The dw1 is the fuel-economy edition atf that's thinner than the z1.

The z1 replacements are cheaper than the dw1 replacements. So if you got the older oil as factory fill I don't see the sense in paying substantially more for the dw1 equivalent.

[kryptonite]

So my new 2007 CL9 with barely 47000K on it seems to have a strange behaviour with holding onto revs (like it is not shifting down sometimes)
Like today, I am rolling down hill for about 150 meters @ about 65km, I let go off the accelerator and it feels like its still holding on @ just a little over 2000 RPM.

Other times I back off the accelerator on a straight and every now and then it doesn't want to shift down, still holding @ 2000rpm unless I tap the brakes or accelerator.

I didn't notice this behaviour from my 2003 CL9 I owned before???




I think a transmission flush in order but which of these is better given the are about the same price.

which of these specs is better

NULON FS
http://www.nulon.com.au/products/Automatic_Transmission_Fluids/Full_Synthetic_Multi_Vehicle_Automatic_Transmissio n_Fluid/#applications

or

PENRITE ATF LV

http://www.penriteoil.com.au/products_o.php?id_categ=1&id_products=709

[Haanda]

Both would have to meet the manufacturers specs and both company's produce excellent oils. Have a think about Valvoline Maxlife ATF as well. But it's your call really.

[Jasemas]

Good luck finding Penrite ATF LV anywhere
And if you do, the cost would be pretty expensive lol

I wouldn't use MAxxlife in such a 'new' car

[AndrewRox22]

Nulon FS only meets Honda 89, 96 and Z1 specs so it's equal to Penrite ATF FS http://www.penriteoil.com.au/products.php?id_categ=3&=&id_products=336

used both, no real difference, just stuck with penrite based on preference

LV is in some stores but not many due to most cars using DW1 or similar specs are still under warranty so not much popularity yet

DW1 is a bit thinner

[kryptonite]

giving these guys a shot for Penrite LV

http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/liverpool/oil-coolant-liquids/penrite-atf-multi-vehicle-lv-full-synthetic-transmission-oil-4-l/1061030112

[Haanda]

Good luck finding Penrite ATF LV anywhere
And if you do, the cost would be pretty expensive lol

I wouldn't use MAxxlife in such a 'new' car

Why not? I've got it in my MY12. Feels no different to the factory fill stuff. As long as the oil used meets the required specs, then there should not be an issue.

[Haanda]

Just did the 3 x 3 again. (11 months and 14,500kms on from the previous time.) Used Valvoline Maxlife Synthetic ATF again.
What came out on the 1st drop was reddish brown but the next 2 drops were bright red. No "swarf" on the magnetic drain plug which is a good sign. The changes are super smooth again.
I will do it again in 12 months time. The cost really is not all that over the hill and is certainly cheaper than a complete transmission replacement.

[AndrewRox22]

Just did the 3 x 3 again. (11 months and 14,500kms on from the previous time.) Used Valvoline Maxlife Synthetic ATF again.
What came out on the 1st drop was reddish brown but the next 2 drops were bright red. No "swarf" on the magnetic drain plug which is a good sign. The changes are super smooth again.
I will do it again in 12 months time. The cost really is not all that over the hill and is certainly cheaper than a complete transmission replacement.

did you drive around using all of the gears between drops?

Honda recommend 60,000km or 36 months then 40,000 or 24 months so i just do 1 drop yearly (approx 18,000km). Cant bring myself to drop new fluid

A little strange they give the factory fill an extra year? is it to get it through warranty or to make money for the dealer out of warranty

[Haanda]

Oh yes. About 10 Km round trip between each drop and refill, getting up to 80 km/h to ensure that all 5 gears came into play. Then I switched it into "S" mode and used the paddle shift to go through all gears. Also 2 x 100 m reverse gear sections.

My cars book specifies 120,000 kms for the 1st drop........And there is no mention of doing it again in the book....I take that to mean that it be done again at 240,000 kms. No way!!!! (New fluid is cheaper than a new gearbox.)

A very good friend of mine owns a cab (Falcon) and has being operating cabs for more than 20 years. The current Falcons have a sealed tranny and according to Ford, do not require any fluid changes for the life of the transmission.
Tranny's operated a such usually last around 250,000- 300,000 kms. Most experienced operators ignore that and get the fluid changed at 18 month intervals as well as fit an external aftermarket cooler. They find that they can get double the life from the tranny by doing this.
O.K.-- That's a Ford as opposed to a Honda, but the practice of frequent fluid changes is the secret to extending the life of any machinery requiring oil as a lubricant.

[Fredoops]

I got both an external cooler and frequent fluid changes and I change the filter. Going good so far.

Ps: Penrite just came out with a new full synthetic atf. The Low Viscosity atf that's DW1 compliant. Basically a thinner oil.

[AndrewRox22]

Ps: Penrite just came out with a new full synthetic atf. The Low Viscosity atf that's DW1 compliant. Basically a thinner oil.

yeah, the LV http://www.penriteoil.com.au/products.php?id_categ=3&=&id_products=709

been eyeing it for a while now but havent seen it recommended for any hondas yet, not even the new accord

[Haanda]

[QUOTE=Fredoops;3988917]I got both an external cooler and frequent fluid changes and I change the filter. Going good so far.

I like the idea of an external trans cooler. Is their a Accord specific kit available, or did you do a "scratch build" using bits obtained from other sources?

[Haanda]

yeah, the LV http://www.penriteoil.com.au/products.php?id_categ=3&=&id_products=709

been eyeing it for a while now but havent seen it recommended for any hondas yet, not even the new accord


They have said that their new ATF LV meets Honda DW-1 specs in their ATF Flyer.

The list of specs it meets are: ( Honda DW1 is no 10 on the list)

Product Specification

Aisin AW-1
BMW Part# 83 22 0 397 114
BMW Part# 83 22 0 397 859
BMW Part# 83 22 9 407 858
Ford MERCON®-LV (M2C938-A)
Ford M2C922-A1
Ford M2C924-A
GM DEXRON®-VI
Hyundai SP-IV
Honda DW-1
JASO 1A
JASO 2A-02
JWS 3324
Kia SP-IV
Mercedes MB 236.41
Mitsubishi SP-IV
Mitsubishi Dia Queen J2/J3
Nissan/Infiniti Matic S
Toyota WS

[AndrewRox22]

They have said that their new ATF LV meets Honda DW-1 specs in their ATF Flyer.

The list of specs it meets are: ( Honda DW1 is no 10 on the list)

I am aware of that, it's just the lube guide and penrite still dont recommend it for our application.... the new accord recommends DW1 in the manual but penrite have yet to update it from ATF FS

[Haanda]

Probably because Honda will require some sort of payment for giving their "tick" to the product.

(My Euro came from John Blair Honda in Prahan. They use Caltex Havoline ATF-J in their workshop for transmission fluid changes.
Simply because they can buy it in bulk, at a good price.)

[Fredoops]

Probably because Honda will require some sort of payment for giving their "tick" to the product.

(My Euro came from John Blair Honda in Prahan. They use Caltex Havoline ATF-J in their workshop for transmission fluid changes.
Simply because they can buy it in bulk, at a good price.)

No. Honda don't give tick to anyone actually (with one exception being the engine oil for the Acura RDX in the usa). It's completely in house unlike the GM dexos standards where it's pay to play.

The reason for it not in the lube guide is simple:

Lubeguide is a third party site that sells the service to oil makers . It takes time to update their systems. Being the penrite LV was released recently it'll probably be a while before the LV and their DSG/DCT fluid makes it onto lube guide.

Therefore if it says on the bottle.... it's all good.

[Fredoops]

[QUOTE=Fredoops;3988917]I got both an external cooler and frequent fluid changes and I change the filter. Going good so far.

I like the idea of an external trans cooler. Is their a Accord specific kit available, or did you do a "scratch build" using bits obtained from other sources?

There's no accord specific kit. It's just an universal kit I got. I run that in addition to the radiator "cooler" that the transmission is plugged into already. So there's 2 coolers in my system

[Haanda]

Can you supply a fluid flow direction diagram please?

[Fredoops]

Didn't need one.

Two hoses goes into the radiator I just wired it off one. The cooler I got doesn't have a flow direction so it didn't matter whether you add it to the in or return line.

[Haanda]

O.K. I'll see if. I can find out which of the 2 hoses is supply and return, so that the fluid goes from the radiator to the external cooler and then returns to the transmission.

[Martin77]

Hi there,

I am new at this forum as I bought an 05 Accord Euro about a month ago.
I found this forum very helpful as now I know that the service schedule for the AT of 120k km is not sufficient.
I obtained from this forum that a 3X3 change is what I need at reduced interval (not 120k km). It is necessary but realised that this is going to be expensive and time consuming for me. I am aware that a complete flush is not recommended by Honda as it might introduce air to the system.

May I get an opinion from you guys about a conservative flush method and see if this is ok. With this I would reduce the oil used and time spent changing the oil. This uses 2 people to do it.
Step:
1. Change the oil as normal (drop 3L and fill 3L via dip stick tube)
2. Undo hose to the radiator (passenger side) and position on a graduated oil pan (volume indicator)
3. The second person start the car (in park or cycling the transmission)
4. Oil will come out of the radiator hose and in about 5-10 seconds it will reach 2.5 L
5. Ask driver to stop the car
6. Reconnect hose and fill the dipstick tube until full (theoretically 2.5 L)
7. Run engine for a few minutes, check level and top up if necessary

This method is similar to this you tube video but done more conservatively so that air does not get into the system by removing only 2.5L. If the transmission contained 6.2 L, this method technically remove 5.5/6.2=85%.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQsVuUOK6Cg

What are your thoughts?

Edit: the website is this below, please ignore the top link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZAmcEf9LrY

[Haanda]

Remember that air gets in every time the transmission dip stick is checked and it is through the dipstick tube that air will be vented, so not necessary to do the hose to radiator disconnection bit. If it was, then the factory would also make that the method and probably have some sort of an inbuilt drain system designed into it.
(Undoing a hose clamp and then carefully draining out a measured amount of oil is NOT the way Japanese engineers would approach such a task. :) )
3 x 3 will see a good % of the oil changed and doing the radiator connection hose bit, is effectively doing a 4 x 4. (The amount of oil dropped from the trans each "dump" is closer to 2.8 litres.)
The 3 x 3 drop is how a Honda Dealer would do it anyway. All the thread recommends is doing it a bit more often than Honda state in the manual. ( No need to try and re invent the wheel ;))

[Fredoops]

Hi there,
I obtained from this forum that a 3X3 change is what I need at reduced interval (not 120k km). It is necessary but realised that this is going to be expensive and time consuming for me. I am aware that a complete flush is not recommended by Honda as it might introduce air to the system.


3x3 is what you do when you haven't replaced the oil in a long time (ie: those who followed the service book)

if you do changes very regularly then a 1x1 every service (or 2nd service if you don't do a lot of kay's) would be sufficient imo, so after your initial 3x3 + filter change, just do a 1x1 (simple drain/fill) every service (or 2nd service) or something would be sufficient.

Theres not really any need to do a 3x3 every 2nd service, thats too expansive, also you really dont need to use honda OEM fluid, most good quality full synthetic ATF are ATF-Z1 compatible now days, so thats like an instant 50% saving.




Step:
1. Change the oil as normal (drop 3L and fill 3L via dip stick tube)
2. Undo hose to the radiator (passenger side) and position on a graduated oil pan (volume indicator)
3. The second person start the car (in park or cycling the transmission)
4. Oil will come out of the radiator hose and in about 5-10 seconds it will reach 2.5 L
5. Ask driver to stop the car
6. Reconnect hose and fill the dipstick tube until full (theoretically 2.5 L)
7. Run engine for a few minutes, check level and top up if necessary
...
...
What are your thoughts?


If you had to do this method would it not be better to fill the dipstick while it drains? that would reduce/prevent air from getting in.




The 3 x 3 drop is how a Honda Dealer would do it anyway. All the thread recommends is doing it a bit more often than Honda state in the manual. ( No need to try and re invent the wheel ;))

Actually honda dealers only do a 1x1 @120k km, that was my experience anyway, they only do 3x3 when you complain about transmission problems.

[Martin77]

Thanks for the feedback Fred and Handa. Maybe you are right. There is no need to reinvent the wheel.

I just wanted to think a way to make the ATF change more effectively (and also safely) as it is expensive and a hassle removing the plastic cover to do the ATF. Maybe it can be stretched to 40-50k using this technique.

I bought the car a month ago at 130k km and the ATF has not been changed. Its lucky that the transmission is still good (smooth) as the previous owner uses the car mainly highway driving and uses it gently (I dont think he ever engaged the vtec). I replaced the oil with redline D4 oil as redline was the oil I used on my previous car and it was good. I bought it for approx $85 per gallon (3.7 L), its expensive.
To me doing the flush is a little more risky but I am sure it is more effective than conducting multiple drain and refill as the drain and refill method mixes the old and new oil before the consecutive changes. The number 2.5 L I used is a number I used to ensure that no (significant) air get into the system (we have 3L inside the pan). This can be reduced to 2L being more conservative. Fred the reason for not filling the dipstick as the system is flushed is done so that full attention (reduce the risk) can be given to the volume of oil that has been removed to the drain pan and alert the driver to stop the engine.

Fred, can you please tell me if you notice some difference between Redline D4 and Valvoline maxlife ATF fluid?

[Fredoops]

Fred, can you please tell me if you notice some difference between Redline D4 and Valvoline maxlife ATF fluid?

I've noticed no difference between the two, then again I added an external ATF cooler half way thru my Redline D4 drain cycle, both stayed very clean and very smooth throughout it's 1 year life.

Not that matters all that much, it seems that Maxlife had been discontinued in oz, cant find them in repco or supercheap, Autobarn sometimes have them but most of the time i cant see it on the shelf.

And with the current aussie dollar rate i cant justify the the cost of the Redline D4 anymore either.

So now I have 4 bottles of Nulon Multi-vehicle synthetic atf sitting in the garage, they'll be the next one for me to try.

[AndrewRox22]

So now I have 4 bottles of Nulon Multi-vehicle synthetic atf sitting in the garage, they'll be the next one for me to try.

I've used it, noticed nothing wrong or special with it- it costs a bit more than the penrite version

I found simply changing the inline filter has extended the smoothness as well

[Martin77]

Thank you Fred.
You mentioned you installed an atf cooler on your car and I am assuming this cooler is mounted in front of the A/C evaporator.
I have heard that the Euro A/C (similar to crv) often can give us grief from the heat it generated. This document/link below mentioned an increased A/C cycle due to evaporator under- sizing. Would an ATF cooler mounted in front of it makes it worse?
Should we change the A/C clutch as a preventative maintenance?
http://hondakarma.com/threads/cr-v-air-conditioning-compressor-failure.181/live?page=1

[Fredoops]

I've used it, noticed nothing wrong or special with it- it costs a bit more than the penrite version
Yes I've noticed that.

Gotta say the penrite full syn atf pricing is really odd. At 40 bucks retail for 4 litre when the semi synthetic penrite atf cost upwards 35 bucks.

While the Valvoline Maxlife and Nulon Full Syn Atf are around 55.

Both cheaper than honda oem at 70 a bottle tho.

Thank you Fred.
You mentioned you installed an atf cooler on your car and I am assuming this cooler is mounted in front of the A/C evaporator.
I have heard that the Euro A/C (similar to crv) often can give us grief from the heat it generated. This document/link below mentioned an increased A/C cycle due to evaporator under- sizing. Would an ATF cooler mounted in front of it makes it worse?
Should we change the A/C clutch as a preventative maintenance?
http://hondakarma.com/threads/cr-v-air-conditioning-compressor-failure.181/live?page=1

Yes it's mounted in front of the ac condenser.

The one I added is not big. Only the size of an ipad. Can't imagine it doing that much.

Regarding changing ac clutch. That's no small job.

I cant comment on aircon performance I don't run R134a in my ac system anymore. I use hydrocarbon refrigerant instead which is twice as efficient there abouts so my ac system runs on less pressure and stress.

[AndrewRox22]

Yes I've noticed that.

Gotta say the penrite full syn atf pricing is really odd. At 40 bucks retail for 4 litre when the semi synthetic penrite atf cost upwards 35 bucks.
.

what are you seeing as odd? the price itself or the price difference?

[Fredoops]

The price difference (or the lack thereof)

[Martin77]

Until the 16th Jan, Super cheap is doing special on the Nulon synthetic ATF. Its $38.33 on the website.
A tad cheaper compared to their normal 20% sale.

[Fredoops]

Until the 16th Jan, Super cheap is doing special on the Nulon synthetic ATF. Its $38.33 on the website.
A tad cheaper compared to their normal 20% sale.

Thats where i got mine. all 4 bottles of it

[Haanda]

One other point that I forgot to mention. Remember that when doing a 3 x 3 change, you have to drive the car for a few kms, or at least start the engine when the car is on the hoist and operate the transmission through all gears to circulate the fluid (a mixture of, old and new) through the system.
This will also flush the new mix through the transmission cooler. So opening the system up between the transmission and the transmission cooler is not going to achieve any benefit, other than dropping out more of the mixed fluid. ;) Also, the transmission is not a sealed, pressured system and vents to atmosphere via the dipstick tube. There will be some air in there at all times.

As regards Valvoline Maxlife. It is still here in Oz. I used it in my 1st 3 x 3 change, just after I bought the car 11 months ago and have just used it for the 2nd 3 x 3. But rather than looking for 4 litre containers of the stuff at Auto Accessory Shops, I got my local garage, who use Valvoline products across the board, to do the changes (with me in attendance) when they did the last normal 10,000m km interval service. They stock it in bulk and use it in quite a few different makes of vehicle (I also use it in my SAAB's Auto Trans.)
They did not mind me taking the car off the hoist between fills and disappearing for 15 minutes to do the prerequisite drive arounds.

Now that I have done two lots of 3 x 3 changes, I am confident that pretty well all of the original factory initial fill fluid has been removed and I will also be doing as Freedops says, a single drop/refill annually.

[Martin77]

Thanks Haanda,

I think whatever we do (flush or drain/refill) it is important to realise that we need to change the ATF regularly. More frequently than what Honda suggests (1 drain and refill at 120k km). The automatic transmission is a crucial component in a car and if that goes, its going to be expensive to repair and if the car is more than 10 years old it may not be worth repairing. The frequency will depend on the style of driving and what is important is sticking to the frequency more so than the method. According to this forum, if the car has been serviced according to the log book, an initial 3X3 followed by a simple drain/refill at each/second service is the gold standard.

It seems like the Valvoline Maxlife is very popular here.

It seems like what Fredoops has done is correct by tackling the core issue of the ATF problem, which is inadequate cooling to the ATF. He has installed an ATF cooler in front of the A/C condenser to assist with the cooling. If there is enough cooling, ATF should last a long time. This method is not for everyone as there is a potential issue in the reduction of A/C condenser efficiency if the cooler is placed infront of it. Fredoops has done a fix by using a more efficient refrigerant.

[Haanda]

Certainly changing the fluid more frequently will definitely prolong the life of any mechanical equipment. My work background was in the Oil Industry and the company I worked for had a strict preventative maintenance policy of changing the oil every 3 months, on all mechanical equipment, irrespective of whether it was electric, internal combustion or steam driven, (yes, we used large, multi stage steam turbines! ;) ) Some equipment also had auto type radiator coolers and the coolant in those was changed annually. There was a good reason and it is a policy that has stuck with me!
I have mentioned that I also own a SAAB ( a 20 year old one at that) and that has both an auto transmission cooler and an engine oil cooler. The former is mounted under the radiator so that it does not interfere with the engine cooling. Mind you, the fact that there is a Turbo intercooler at the very front , followed by an airconditioner condenser then the engine radiator, may also have something to do with the location. Even the manual transmission SAAB Turbo's have a gearbox oil cooler.

One thing that both my mechanic and I noticed when doing the 3 x 3, was just how hot the fluid and the drain plug was when we went to drain the fluid after a run of only 10 kms. One could not hold the plug. That heat will be the main reason why the fluid goes off.

I have also had some input into Taxi operation since I retired from the Oil Industry and savvy taxi owners also install external transmission coolers on their cars, be it Ford, GM, Chrysler or Toyota. It does prolong the life of the transmission, often for the entire time the car is on the road in Taxi service. They also do frequent transmission oil changes irrespective of what the manufacturer specifies.
So yes, to sum up, more frequent oil changes, with a top quality synthetic oil ( make your own choice of brand. As long as it meets the manufacturers specs it will be fine)works well. Installing a trans cooler ( it doesn't have to be big. Lowering the fluid temperature by just a few degrees C makes a huge difference) will also help maximise the life of the transmission.

Happy :honda: ring :D

[Martin77]

Thanks Haanda. Very useful information.

Some of our CL9s are aging a little (mine has) and probably need a replacement radiator soon.
Does anyone know of a better/performance radiator that could cool the automatic transmission fluid better than the stock radiator?

[Fredoops]

Thanks Haanda. Very useful information.

Some of our CL9s are aging a little (mine has) and probably need a replacement radiator soon.
Does anyone know of a better/performance radiator that could cool the automatic transmission fluid better than the stock radiator?

No, there isnt. it's just the oem design, the trans cooler i added is only the size of an iPad Mini

[Haanda]

There are some AM manufacturers that use better grade alloys in their products than the OEM unit. Nissens and Fenix are 2 brands that come to mind (in both cases of those names, the end product comes from the same factory, but with a different name on the box.) But you will usually pay as much or more, than Honda OEM.

[Ten]

Great guide. Changed the fluid and filter on mine today. Found it easiest to remove the airbox to get at the filter. :)

[CL9_euro]

Hey Fredoops this thread is thoroughly informative and helpful on so many levels.
Anyway I'm planning to change my ATF this weekend.
My car's gone 105000kms without having 1 ATF change (bought it last month) & after reading this thread I'll be certain to drain the ATF of 3 quartz/2.8L for each of the next 3 services (105000km, 110000km & 115000km).

I have one question to ask..
From your experience do you recommend I buy the:

- Redline Synth D4 from performancelub @ $23 per quartz ($69 total)

- Penrite LV @ $49 for 4L
http://m.supercheapauto.com.au/Product/Penrite-LV-Automatic-Transmission-Fluid-LV-4-Litre/396357

- Nulon 100% Synthetic Multi-Vehicle *edit $44 for 4L*
http://m.supercheapauto.com.au/Product/Nulon-100-Synthetic-Multi-Vehicle-Auto-Transmission-Fluid-4-Litre/164776

Mind you it would be cheaper as well as more convenient for me to go to supercheap as its closer (for the penrite/nulon) as compared to driving to greensborough/pay for postage @ performancelub (redline)

[Martin77]

Welcome to ozhonda CL9_euro.
In regards to the service interval, with good synthetic oil, this car can go to 10,000 km service interval (normal driving). It would be a waste of money and time to doing it every 5,000 km. When you changed the atf once at 105,000 km, the second and third doesn't become as urgent (10000 is OK compared to 5000 km). This would be more cost and time effective.

Or you could do the gold standard which is the 3x drain and refill at 105,000 km.

[CL9_euro]

Welcome to ozhonda CL9_euro.
In regards to the service interval, with good synthetic oil, this car can go to 10,000 km service interval (normal driving). It would be a waste of money and time to doing it every 5,000 km. When you changed the atf once at 105,000 km, the second and third doesn't become as urgent (10000 is OK compared to 5000 km). This would be more cost and time effective.

Or you could do the gold standard which is the 3x drain and refill at 105,000 km.

Cheers Martin. Looks like ill do the intervals at every 10000kms.
Have you tried all the 3 oils i mentioned above?
- Redline D4
- PenriteLV
- Nulon 100% Synthetic Multi-Vehicle

Which one do you recommend?

[Fredoops]

I used redline d4.

Forget it. It's no better than penrite or nulon for normal driving. Not worth the money IMO.

Nulon or Penrite is fine.

Btw you don't HAVE to use the more expensive penrite atf LV for a cl9. The normal syn multi atf is ok as welll

[Martin77]

Fredoops is probably right. He has alot more experience with the CL9.
I am using redline D4 and it is expensive. I have not tried nulon or penrite.
When I read reviews about redline oil, because of its group 5 base stock, it can tolerate higher temperature (oxidation). I do not know if this is the case with their atf fluid.

[AndrewRox22]

Fredoops is probably right. He has alot more experience with the CL9.
I am using redline D4 and it is expensive. I have not tried nulon or penrite.
When I read reviews about redline oil, because of its group 5 base stock, it can tolerate higher temperature (oxidation). I do not know if this is the case with their atf fluid.

better base stocks last longer but if you are going to start changing it more regularly, it's not as much of a big deal IMO

Honda recommends 60,000km/36 months they should do 3 drains 3 fills with some driving between to get most of the old oil out...

I'd personally do 2 drains minimum if yours hasn't been done for 100,000km

Been doing mine yearly since I got it but only as a single drain and fill of 3-4L... my car did 120,000km until it's first change and by then it was a bit jerky with shifting, despite honda servicing it, they never told the previous owners to change the oil

[Martin77]

I am sure Hondas recommended atf change is 120000 km (1x drain and refill), which is too long.
I would agree with AndrewRox22, if there are transmission issues/symptoms, a 2x drain and refil (even 3) should be done straight away.
There is also an inline atf filter that should be changed regularly.

[Fredoops]

better base stocks last longer but if you are going to start changing it more regularly, it's not as much of a big deal

Bingo. If you're doing once a year fluid changes then it doesn't matter as much the base oil. Uless you go onracetracks or something

[CL9_euro]

I ended up buying PENRITE LV for ATF & PENRITE 10TENTHS PREMIUM 0 0W-40 for the engine oil.

The gunk on the magnet of the bolt looks like it needed a a ATF change after not having one since new.
I will do the 2nd drain in 20,000km time from now

29509
29510

[Martin77]

Please let us know how the car goes.
I am sensing that you really want to look after your car with good oil selection but still being sensible and practical. Thanks for the photos.

[Fredoops]

The gunk on the magnet of the bolt looks like it needed a a ATF change after not having one since new.
I will do the 2nd drain in 20000km time]

If I'm you I'd do a second drain asap.

Unless you just did a 3x3

Given the amount of gunk on the magnet. Change the filter too

[CL9_euro]

Please let us know how the car goes.
I am sensing that you really want to look after your car with good oil selection but still being sensible and practical. Thanks for the photos.

Yeh thanks mate, really want to look after this car hence the penrite bottles.
Just took it for a drive and the gear changes are smoother, espesh from 1st to 2nd where I sense the massive difference.


If I'm you I'd do a second drain asap.
Unless you just did a 3x3
Given the amount of gunk on the magnet. Change the filter too

Cheers fredoops. Will most likely do the 2nd drain next weekend due to shortage of time today as I have plans.
Yep bought the transmission filter yesterday from essendon honda $55.
That was a c*nt to change lol. Lucky im a clean guy no oil/fluid drips at all :)

[cbauto]

Bingo. If you're doing once a year fluid changes then it doesn't matter as much the base oil. Uless you go onracetracks or something
This

Regular service intervals don't need expensive fluid

[AndrewRox22]

Yeh thanks mate, really want to look after this car hence the penrite bottles.
Just took it for a drive and the gear changes are smoother, espesh from 1st to 2nd where I sense the massive difference.

That was a c*nt to change lol. Lucky im a clean guy no oil/fluid drips at all :)

The LV is DW1 grade so much thinner, would make a huge difference, gotta give it a try sometime when it's on special

I do a sneaky and take off only 1 side of the plastic guard and slip my catch pan in there haha

would have been it's first change because honda don't have the item on the service schedule until 120,000km/6 years for the factory fill

i agree with a minimum of a second drop, 10L+ capacity, how much did you get out?

[CL9_euro]

would have been it's first change because honda don't have the item on the service schedule until 120,000km/6 years for the factory fill
i agree with a minimum of a second drop, 10L+ capacity, how much did you get out?

Got out exactly 2.8L.
I don't know if you can see it here:
:thumbsup:
29514

[cbauto]

honda don't have the item on the service schedule until 120,000km/6 years for the factory fill



BMW say their ATF is fill for life.

does that sound right to you?

[AndrewRox22]

BMW say their ATF is fill for life.

does that sound right to you?

they also tell you that you don't need dipsticks haha

Nothing is ever 'for life' unless it's the life of their warranty

[Martin77]

I think BMW is right. Its for the life of the transmission, which is not very long if you don't change the oil. :-)

[08r3308]

Was able to get motul atf VI cheaper than honda oem.
They claim compatibility with z1 and dw1 so will give that a go next time. Anyone used motul in their auto?

[Martin77]

Can you please tell us where you got the motul atf from and how much were they?

[moomoocow]

Great post!

My Honda Legend KB1 (J35a engine) has recently done around 170k and has followed all the service schedules. The ATF was changed during the 120k service. Just checked the fluid, and the colour seemed to be brown (non-black and doesn't smell burnt). Can someone please give me some guidance as to what's the best way to approach this? I'm mindful that there could be some transmission damage and if I put in new fluid it might raise the sediments and therefore increasing the risk of damaging the transmission?

Also what ATF should I get? Would any of the ATF-DW1 equivalent on the front page do the job?

Thanks!

[AndrewRox22]

Great post!

My Honda Legend KB1 (J35a engine) has recently done around 170k and has followed all the service schedules. The ATF was changed during the 120k service. Just checked the fluid, and the colour seemed to be brown (non-black and doesn't smell burnt). Can someone please give me some guidance as to what's the best way to approach this? I'm mindful that there could be some transmission damage and if I put in new fluid it might raise the sediments and therefore increasing the risk of damaging the transmission?

Also what ATF should I get? Would any of the ATF-DW1 equivalent on the front page do the job?

Thanks!

change it, 50,000km is nothing to worry about but it should be a red. is there a reason you think there would be problems with changing it or why you think there would be sediment?

check what your manual recommends but it should be compatible with the same fluids in the first post, DW1 is required for all new Honda trans coming out of the factory now but all older ones are able to take Z1 which is a bit thicker and cheaper.... DW1 is supposed to be backwards compatible though

http://www.datateck.com.au/Lube/PenriteAus/

3 drops and 3 fill method with some driving in between will change most of the oil in there otherwise others have offered suggestions on what they do

[cbauto]

Great post!

My Honda Legend KB1 (J35a engine) has recently done around 170k and has followed all the service schedules. The ATF was changed during the 120k service. Just checked the fluid, and the colour seemed to be brown (non-black and doesn't smell burnt). Can someone please give me some guidance as to what's the best way to approach this? I'm mindful that there could be some transmission damage and if I put in new fluid it might raise the sediments and therefore increasing the risk of damaging the transmission?

Also what ATF should I get? Would any of the ATF-DW1 equivalent on the front page do the job?

Thanks!
Change fluid.then change again after 5k and again after 10k from initial service.

Will be new again

[08r3308]

Can you please tell us where you got the motul atf from and how much were they?

Ebay . I had a voucher too. I seen they are around $25 a litre tho.
Will try and post how i go :)
Not much info on motul stuff.

[Fredoops]

Ebay . I had a voucher too. I seen they are around $25 a litre tho.
Will try and post how i go :)
Not much info on motul stuff.

$25 a liter? Jesus....

[noob1]

hi since brand new my auto accord euro would jerk and make a loud noise when shifted to R from P only when parked up hill.

is this normal?

[Fredoops]

Yeah. That's normal.

[JulianYJK]

I think my transmission is stuffed. works but sounds like a whinning b#@$h. Anyone had this before?

[AndrewRox22]

I think my transmission is stuffed. works but sounds like a whinning b#@$h. Anyone had this before?

video? when does it appear? does it do it in park, Reverse, neutral? Does it shift ok? no info so we can't really say anything

make sure it isn't your powersteering, that can get loud as it dies

[JulianYJK]

hi andrewrox22

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDp-fhl3dvw - exactly similar to this.

-it happens during acceleration.
-Its an auto transmission
-when I fang the car, the engine drowns the whine
- gear engages just fine. a lot of city driving recently.
- car has done 160k km

how do you know If your power steering has died? what symptoms can I expect from it?

[Martin77]

If its the power steering, the whine will be noticeable during revving in park or neutral.
If it is the transmission, you should do oil and filter change and hope it improves.

[AndrewRox22]

I think there was a thread here sometime last year with this same issue, cant find it at the moment but i don't think it's the transmission...

nevertheless, you should still do some changes on it to see if it affects it at all... maybe make another thread and see if anyone knows

[Fredoops]

could be a blown alternator too

[noob1]

Yeah. That's normal.

What's the explanation behind it, how come other cars don't do that?

[Fredoops]

It's called a parking pawl. All auto transmissions have it
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parking_pawl

It's a metal pin that locks transmission in place.

[Martin77]

Fredoops is right.
The transmission (or pin in the transmission) doesn't like being stressed (ie, to move in one particular direction if the car has the tendency to move in another direction (in a slope)).

To reduce this (when changing direction on a slope) you could use the park brake or your foot brake (and accelerate a little) when you travel the opposite direction of where the car wants to roll.

If you park you car on a slope it is a good idea to let the park brake take the rolling tension instead of the transmission. So you stop, pull the park brake, let the foot brake go for a milli second (car will roll a little to the direction of the slope) and put in park on your transmission.

[JulianYJK]

Fredoops is right.
The transmission (or pin in the transmission) doesn't like being stressed (ie, to move in one particular direction if the car has the tendency to move in another direction (in a slope)).

To reduce this (when changing direction on a slope) you could use the park brake or your foot brake (and accelerate a little) when you travel the opposite direction of where the car wants to roll.

If you park you car on a slope it is a good idea to let the park brake take the rolling tension instead of the transmission. So you stop, pull the park brake, let the foot brake go for a milli second (car will roll a little to the direction of the slope) and put in park on your transmission.



Brought it to Honda specialist. He said it was the bearings in the transmission. I did a transmission flush. It was black and dirty. Anyways, he said if my gearbox fails in future, Hw can fit A reconditioned one for 1.7k.

I'll live with the whiny noise for now. Thanks guys

[Martin77]

You should also replace the transmission filter if the oil is dirty.
Replacing the filter might improve oil flow and this may help with the noise issue.
You'll need to remove the air filter box to gain access to the transmission in line filter.

It is recommended here to do drain and refill of the transmission fluid a couple of times if it is dirty (oxidised from heat) as one change only remove half of the oil.

[ribze1]

Great thread, thank you so much.

My '06 Euro is in the process of having it's gearbox flushed - drained 3L on the weekend and filled, will do again when I receive my Magnefine filter.

Btw I used Liqui Moly Top Tex ATF 1200 (fully synthetic):

http://www.liqui-moly.de/liquimoly/produktdb.nsf/id/en_3680.html

[Fredoops]

Excellent.

How dark is the fluid coming out?

[ribze1]

Excellent.

How dark is the fluid coming out?

Pretty brown with plenty of bits of metal coming out. Particularly when compared to the fresh red ATF that went in.

[AndrewRox22]

Pretty brown with plenty of bits of metal coming out. Particularly when compared to the fresh red ATF that went in.

bits of metal?!?!...... how big are we talking? could be an issue if we are talking big.....

the magnet on the plug should have caught all of the small bits/ filings which are normal

[ribze1]

bits of metal?!?!...... how big are we talking? could be an issue if we are talking big.....

the magnet on the plug should have caught all of the small bits/ filings which are normal

Not that big, I could see it as the fluid gushed out. The magnet did it's job too, plenty of metal filings on it,
My mate (mechanic) didn't have any concerns.

[Fredoops]

Update 13.

new transmission added, happens to be made by AISIN, a Japanese transmission manufacturer owned partly by Toyota, and happens to make transmissions of similar design to Honda's

[Jasemas]

Good old Aisin
They make boxes for BMW too

[Jasemas]

Good old Aisin
They make boxes for BMW too

[Fredoops]

Good old Aisin
They make boxes for BMW too


as well as alfa romeos, opel/gm and ford.

i have a feeling those aisin gearboxes are very similar to Honda's .

[laijer]

Anyone know what the part number to solenoid type C is? I've looked at the Acura online eStore and it's a bit confusing. Tried to image Google it and YouTube it and that didn't make it any clearer.

Started getting the flashing green "D" light in every now and then - and my auto wont shift past the 3rd gear when it happens (VSA lights up, picture of the gear/cog in the dash and the engine alert light comes up too).
There's a pretty rough gear shift from 1st to 2nd if I don't lay off the accelerator at the shift point. I have to stop the car and turn it off for a minute and then I can restart it and can usually drive it normally again (shifts past 3rd).
I took it into the local mechanic for a scan and it said shift solenoid Type C was faulty.

[fleeball]

Anyone know what the part number to solenoid type C is? I've looked at the Acura online eStore and it's a bit confusing. Tried to image Google it and YouTube it and that didn't make it any clearer.

Started getting the flashing green "D" light in every now and then - and my auto wont shift past the 3rd gear when it happens (VSA lights up, picture of the gear/cog in the dash and the engine alert light comes up too).
There's a pretty rough gear shift from 1st to 2nd if I don't lay off the accelerator at the shift point. I have to stop the car and turn it off for a minute and then I can restart it and can usually drive it normally again (shifts past 3rd).
I took it into the local mechanic for a scan and it said shift solenoid Type C was faulty.

I'm having similar issues, car won't shift into 4th gear in auto mode. If I engage semi auto mode I can get the car to shift into 5th, although 4th does not engage. Also car is no longer engaging reverse. Did you have any luck with replacing the shift solenoid?

[laijer]

Nah, the problem just went away.
I took it to HondaWorld in Clayton VIC, the mechanic said it was a part inside the tranny that was worn out and was causing it to lose pressure when it shifted gears and the engine management would detect the pressure loss and basically chuck the car into "safe mode". I had to either reco the tranny or replace it. I was going to get a reco tranny, but the problem stopped appearing.

[fleeball]

Thanks for replying. Looks like I mmight need to get a reco tranny.

[Fredoops]

Thanks for replying. Looks like I mmight need to get a reco tranny.

Look at my original post (the 1st post)

There's a section in there called:
- - - Shift solenoid service!!

You might as well replace all the shift solenoids


LOOKING TO REFLASH YOUR ECU FOR MORE POWER?
GO TO: https://sites.google.com/site/accordeuroreflash/home

[fleeball]

Look at my original post (the 1st post)

There's a section in there called:
- - - Shift solenoid service!!

You might as well replace all the shift solenoids

just an update to close off. replaced the shift solenoids and the transmission still had the same issues. Replaced the transmission with a used one and all is good.

[Martin77]

Hi there,
I am wondering if anyone has a comparison experience with Valvoline Maxlife vs the similarly priced Nulon or Penrite branded ATF? And the more expensive Redline D4/D6 is it only marginally better?
Amazon Prime members can get Valvoline Maxlife for $38 delivered...
https://www.amazon.com.au/Valvoline-1129-04-MaxLife-Multi-Vehicle-ATF/dp/B07G5Y5QDV/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=maxlife+valvoline&qid=1570761537&sr=8-1

[ep3rsteve]

THIS SITE

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcTy7jn55-7b1EFQTL2nHI1fwb9stg-B60Wodf2s41LvqHXX35zi