The lower VTEC point of the mild reflash is at 5000rpm.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_F
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The lower VTEC point of the mild reflash is at 5000rpm.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_F
Thanks tony1234, been looking forward to your impressions.
Can't wait to see 4 myself....:thumbsup:
The exhaust piping is not 3 inch straight though. Because it's a dual exhaust the 2 exhaust pipes actually add up to 5 inches (2.5 inches each side). If each pipe is 3 inches it adds up to 6 inches which resulted in a loss of top end power according to James.Quote:
Originally Posted by ALN
So bottom line :
Seems like the mild flash is bang for buck?
Best thing i noticed about the Mild flash is the lower vtec, smoother take off and higher rev limit
atm my car as soon as it hits 6000rpm its straight onto redline, wild the mild flash i didnt hit the redline at all and had the car into the red line
Pretty good overall, pretty impressed with the top end of the extreme package though, went great
whether you have dual 2.5 or dual 3inch at the rear doesnt change anything... its still gotta go through the entire centre piping (cat converter all the way to the back split) so its not gonna equal 5inch or 6inch unless you use 5/6 inch piping the entire way....Quote:
Originally Posted by sodaz
I'm not sure if it does and but that's what James said. He said that when the twin tails pipes were 3 inches (which it was in one his initial prototypes) they measured a lost of power in the top end. When they changed it to 2.5 inches it made more power. He mentioned something about volume and pressure but i don't remember what he said exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by EUR003act
BTW, i forgot to mention that the exhaust has a special type of lock joint for extra adjustment so you won't get that lopsided look with the twin pipes.
i believe that having too big an exhaust loses power... n/a engines do require some back pressure... and i do know cars with dual exhausts (off a single line) are very hard to tune properly for power...Quote:
Originally Posted by sodaz
No, that's because dual exhausts have 2 additional 90 degree bends before the muffler. A single exhaust can run pretty straight from the cat to the muffler.Quote:
Originally Posted by EUR003act
i was refering more to the debate between whether splitting a single pipe into two and then running two end mufflers is better than just running a single pipe thru a single muffler... but yes thats true, a dual system adds in an extra two bendsQuote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony1234
Hey Tony, my name's Jin. I was the owner of the test car. Sorry i didnt get to say bye. I thought you'd left then i saw you in my rearview.
dont forget to mention that the extreme kit and mild kit seem to fix that really touchy accelerator when you have the car rolling in first gear.
Ive got it on my car right now, and i was driving around all night. It got alot cooler at night.. and the car was alot more responsive.
You won't get any much benefit of 3 inch exhaust from I/H/E minor mods only with tuning. They have to go with "real extreme" mods. You have to combine it with aggressive cams combo and higher flow intake manifold, eg RBC or PRC to get the extra power out of 3 inch exhaust.
Single or dual exhaust, well dunno if there is any difference in dyno but single exhaust for sure will create more responsive feeling than dual.
Does it fix the DBW jerkiness issues in all gears as well?Quote:
Originally Posted by xiang
If that’s the case why would Honda produce the standard Euro with two mufflers ? You think they really would do this to decrease a cars response on purpose; highly unlikely…not to mention a single exhaust on car designed for two mufflers looks dame ugly. As for you saying its more responsive, what evidence and back to back testing have you done to backup your statement or are you just pulling theories from your ass ?Quote:
Originally Posted by ALN
Well I tried on my friend 00 accord 2.3 L did have twin exhaust and before he sold his car he swapped back to single exhaust which made noticeable difference in response, that's personal experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by SXYSOL
If you looking for any more proofs just use yahoo or google, dude or just do it and give us the feedback.
ALN correct in saying single gives better power... why do u think all race setups use single exhaust?
honda didnt go with the dual exhaust system for power! they went with it for looks and quietness...
Its been done already for the Euro and proven that duel is better, so I’m not sure where your getting your facts from, and your experience isn’t even based on a Euro k24 ivtec engine so I would call it skeptical at the very best.Quote:
Originally Posted by ALN
Can you provide us with any proof or article to support it ?
what make you think euro k24 is more special engine compare with k20 that dual exhaust works better than single.
Have u ever think about those people that swap k24a engine to EG or EF or EK which fundamentally works the same and none of them used dual exhaust and still produced higher power figures in comparison to k20a due to higher displacement.
Well I'm not expert in this kinda technical stuff, but few of euro owners here are currently using single exhaust, well may be they could give you more feedback
well... and you can use ur logic why spoon, J's racing,5zigen, Amuse even bother to sell single exhaust if they already knew that dual works better on euro.
what do you mean by jerkiness?Quote:
Originally Posted by BiLL|z0r
well say you're giving it full throttle, and you let go really quick, it is quite jerky.
i also noticed that the engine tempreture is about 25% cooler than it normally is. and that was after a 30 min drive.
im no expert either... but in theory a single exhaust should have better flow characteristics... considering that to make it a dual first u need to split the piping, then you need to add in two more 90degree bends.... all of that adding back pressure and flow disturbences...
Yeah,hi Jin.thanks again for letting me drive your car with the extreme kit on it.Yes i did forget to mention that both reflashes seem to fix that really touchy accelerator when you have the car rolling in first gear.:thumbsup:I'll bet you had fun last night with your car.:pQuote:
Originally Posted by xiang
You have the Extreme kit still on your car !!! HOW IS IT !! Where is the Review ! I guess you LOVE IT !!Quote:
Originally Posted by xiang
is this reflash compatible with the euro?!?
http://www.hondata.com/reflash_tsx.html
Its for the US TSX not our AUS verison of the Euro, their different and not compatible.
hmmmm thought so :( oh well lolQuote:
Originally Posted by akina
A dual muffler has better muffling capacity because there is less air going through each muffler. But the two 90 degree bends before each muffler means that the exhaust gas is slowed down significantly. Single muffler piping can run straight from the middle resonator, so has less restriction. The downside is that a larger amount of exhaust gas is going through 1 muffler and will be noisier. Honda went for a 2 muffler setup for the Euro for 2 reasons. It makes it look upmarket and is easier to keep quiet.Quote:
Originally Posted by SXYSOL
you just said what i said lol only your alot better at explaining it than me..Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
thanks :p
^^ also its aaron... everyone will agree :p
Sif... lol. Come on guys, argue with me...Quote:
Originally Posted by akina
hahaha if we argue with you we'll get kicked off ozhonda lolQuote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
we know how it works... lmao
Hmm
..is that Sir Aaronng...
or
HRH Aaronng.......lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by sodaz
No offence but....I am quite confused how you can equate or compare an Honda Accord Euro that was designed as a "family" car to a Nissan 350z or an RX-8 it does not compute as the Euro was never designed to be an sports car .....or an car that has a V6 engine (Aurion). The closest thing that you can compare the car to is an Toyota Camry or Audi A4 in body type and engine. Even to get compared to a sports car is doing well .....I would have thought the 350z and the RX would have been compared more to the S2000.
Now with the whole argument with Dual verses Single if you had been listening in the presentation....... JTune tested both systems with Single and Dual Systems they did extensive testing ....trust me I know. The car performed better with the system that is the end product (Dual) than that with a straight through. They have proof from dyno results. Besides that as was said by some one else the car was designed with dual tips as it suits the car much better. A single exhaust outlet does not look that good... you have one cutout that is empty on the side that looks strange if does not have a second exhaust. That was also considered.
The Exhaust is a 3 inch System to the just before the petrol tank then splits into two 2.5 inch exhaust pipes into the rear mufflers. Again this was fully tested to get the best results...... They tested this over 2.5 years so I think they know what they are doing.
Also the TSX flash and the Euro flash are from the same source originally but altered to meet Australian specs with some additional tuning from James.
As if I'll do such a thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by EUR003act
Just Aaron is fine. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin086
The Euro can outperform the V6 Camry (115kw) and the Audi A4 2.0 (103kw) even in stock form. Why would you spend $5000 to outperform cars that you can already outperform in stock form? All I'm trying to say is that while the extreme package does improve power noticably compared to stock, it's simply not as quick as I expected. The extreme Euro is supposed to do the 1/4 mile in 14.8ish seconds at 160km/h which is in line with the 350z and RX-8 but it didn't feel nearly as quick as the two. In terms of acceleration it felt closer to the Aurion Sportivo I drive at work (though not as torquey). I don't think there's anything wrong with comparing a stock V6 with a highly modded 4 cylinder car.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peekay34
You are losing the point I am afraid that I am trying to make. I am talking about cars that are normally in the same class and size of engine. Since your comment is that it is "nearly as quick" then I would say ...not bad for a 2.4 litre NA motor that normally on average might have max 110KW at the wheels (notice I said on average folks) The rotary I can not say much about since except that it is very quick and in comparrison of a motor well they are different being based on a low friction Rotary Motor with 1300CC but 170KW of power ...the 350Z is a Standard Engine 3.5L V6 @ 228.18KW @6800 engine .. but both built as sports cars......even if you compare the Aurion... 200KW V6 Engine..... if you compare the two as your are and you say it's close.. and also compare it to an Aurion at 200KW .... Then Jtune has done a great job...... even to be comparible to this car in perfomance.Quote:
Originally Posted by sodaz
It is a shame you did not get to drive it.... you should have asked the owner he let Tony drive it and you would have realised what is fully like :D
Also you gotta remember it was a 30 degree day and humid which also affects performance....
I think your all crazy trying to compare cars on 30 degree days that’s an unfair disadvantage. I would really like to hear how the car responds at night time when the outside air is cold. We all know every car is very sluggish in the heat, but if it impresses you in the heat imagine what it will be like when it’s cold. Out here in WA our cars are always slow during the day and totally different at night in fact a lot of tuners only tune after hours when it cools down.
you should come for a spirited drive in canberra middle of winter... you'd swear your driving an F1 :p lolQuote:
Originally Posted by staryknight
Some cars are worse than others - in my experience the Euro is very different in hot weather compared to crisp weather. It is like a totally different car. Compare that to my SS and the difference is not that much in hot and cold. 3 years ago I started a thread about my Euro having a personality disorder - it is true!Quote:
Originally Posted by staryknight
I don't believe that a stock 350z does a best of 14.8. A stock Euro does 15.2 in real life and the power to weight ratio of the 350z is much better.Quote:
Originally Posted by sodaz
I don't really want to debate this any further as I think it's pointless. But to avoid further confusion, I mean that the RX-8 and 350z (not the revised model with 228kw) both feel a lot quicker than the Euro with the extreme package. The Aurion has 200kw but keep in mind that it's also a massive 240kg heavier than the Euro. Jtune has done a good job designing and manufacturing the hardware with the ECU to match it but in terms of raw performance it didn't quite meet my expectations.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peekay34
I might have a very different impression if I had the car for a full day in winter but all I'm posting is my impressions of being a passenger in the car for a very short period of time.
350Z only have around 155kw atw...
ill be topping that number very soon! lol
A stock std manual Euro does the quarter in the mid to high 15s. The 350z usually does it in the mid to high 14s.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
You answered yourself. The RX-8 and 350z have better power to weight ratios than the Euro, while the Aurion has an additional 60kW but is only 240kg heavier, also giving it a better power to weight ratio. That is why the Euro feels slower than these 3 cars, because it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by sodaz
The Euro feels slower than the RX-8 and 350z but feels about the same as the Aurion (but not as torquey). Power to weight ratio is not a reliable way to determine how fast cars are. There are many other factors that come into play. Anyways I've said what I needed to say so I won't contribute anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
So the only reason the Euro is slow is because it’s a heavy large boat and not a race car.
I brought my euro coz of the looks ;) then I wanted it to go faster :D
Actually read these so Aarong you are wrong based on these articles. But this of course is based on the US model.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....&page_number=1
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....ber=2&preview=
http://www.caranddriver.com/article....&page_number=1
You can't compare numbers from different dynos. A 350z on a rolling road dyno pulling 155kW means a stock Euro put on the same dyno would show 105kW. Unless you get a gain of 50kW, the 350z will still be ahead.Quote:
Originally Posted by EUR003act
J-Toda got 15.2 on WSID. :) If you are getting your figures from magazines, you can't compare them to someone running it on the track. How brutal someone is on the launch and shifts will make more difference than 10kW of power.Quote:
Originally Posted by sodaz
And Sodaz I support fully your comment above....:thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by sodaz
Those 3 links say that the 350z pulls 14.3 and 14.1 second 1/4 mile times. That's much better than 14.8 seconds. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Peekay34
So peekay how does the Euro drive in cooler conditions with JTune Extreme package ?
i will have over 50kw gain form stock soon :) hopefully!Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
im aiming for most powerful n/a euro in aus :D
Go for it! We'll be waiting for vids too. :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by EUR003act
Well just let me say I hope you have good tyres....... Also a lot of effort went it to this the car was even dynoed at 4:00 am in the morning to be certain for the sole reason of having intake tempatures at a stable cold level.. safe for the car also at lower temps the car made another 5KWS at the wheels.....
i made 130kw/atw in 6degree outside temp :p
ive devised for stages of mods... stage 1 is nearly complete! stage two will be done before christmas, and 3/4 before winter next year... by then itll be -4degrees in canberra, so my dyno will kick ass! lol
Interesting well I think I am there already...... but you will have competition....Quote:
Originally Posted by EUR003act
I will have The Jtune package extreme version custom tune up to 50deg cam angle, with new cam gears and soon some race cams
competition is gooooood :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Peekay34
lol but i didnt think 50degree cam was good for the k24? isnt the piston to valve clearance way tooo close for that? hence why on the k24 the VTC only has 25degrees of change, but the k20 has 50?
im gonna grind mine out to about 40-45degrees of VTC :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by EUR003act
Nice can't wait to see it...
Althought I'm still skeptical about your 130Kws with those mods you did....
I can go on my dyno now and recalibrate the settings and make my 134kws read 180 kws on a 40 degree day if I want too LOL!
hahaha everyone is!Quote:
Originally Posted by EuroAccord13
thats why next time ill get mine dyno'd along with peekay :p
Cheeky bugger ...you up for lunch this week.Quote:
Originally Posted by EuroAccord13
If Peekay comes to a Dyno day I organise, he will blow the competition away... *thinks of a way to ban him* heeheeheeheehee.....
whats peekay got atw now?
hmmmm your all just bluffing :p lol jokes
Depends how you go with the added quad throttle boddies that may be going on as well..Quote:
Originally Posted by EUR003act
hahaha now your really pushing the friendship!! hahaha no fairQuote:
Originally Posted by Peekay34
i just got back from my mates place.
i tell you what, the euro drives so nicely in cooler weather. i was impressed at saturdays demo. Cooler temperature makes a noticeable difference. Top end pulls and pulls and pulls.
Im enjoying the extreme kit so much.. i don't want to give it back!
Great write up sodaz
personally, after its all said and done, i wouldnt fork out 4K or however much it costs for an extreme package, let alone for a mild ECO reflash.
but nevertheless, its impressive and also a shock that Jtune finally after all this time released the package. many euro owners would've thought that the day would never come....but i guess u cant rush these things
that being said, personally i'd prefer a euro being a luxury cruiser rather than a sports car wannabe. each to their own
As much as i love my Euro brutha's here in the ACT, On the EXACT SAME dyno that EuroACT used, my car got 86kw at the wheels! So theres some seriously screwed up shit going on at that dyno. It was about 20c when i did it. My cars newer and has only 35 000km to boot.Quote:
Originally Posted by EUR003act
Im actually looking for another ACT dyno thats decent for a run with my I/H plus Hondata.
Forget all that, why is there so few reviews from SAT? Im keen to hear more about the mild flash given Ive already pre - ordered.
hm, well i was on sat, but i came late and left early (had stuff to do) but yer, i didnt get to go in the cars i just really heard the exhaust (which imho is too big/thick, looks too big for the euro) and see the products which do look good and shiny =P
so yer i dont have any real impressions of the products really hehe
Didn't anyone take any photos at all?
ill probably be taking some photos tomorrow.
Jin.when do you have to get the Jtune gear removed?Haha,you'll be depressed after that!!Quote:
Originally Posted by xiang
everything will be off wednesday morning.
haha, i know my car's going to feel so slow.
Ill be at the JDMST meet tomorrow if you guys wanna have a last look at it.
Here are some pics.http://img409.imageshack.us/my.php?i...2007002bt2.jpg
hhttp://img519.imageshack.us/my.php?image=17112007003xt6.jpg
http://img409.imageshack.us/my.php?i...2007004ao3.jpg
hhttp://img442.imageshack.us/my.php?image=17112007001yw6.jpg
http://img442.imageshack.us/my.php?i...2007002bt2.jpg
No.Quote:
Originally Posted by xiang
You will get to work on your 14 page review with pics. Start now. thank you for your co-operation.:eek:
Sorry some didn't upload.Disregard the 3rd.link.:o.I'll try again.
im not one for writing detailed reports, but ill try!Quote:
Originally Posted by Suntzu
soon soon
Thanks for the pics tony1234, I think that's my system hangin' on da wall....
Xiang, would appreciate some pics from the back to see the size of the tips, and under the bonnet would be nice.....
Thanks everyone for the feedback, great to finally have it all happening.
Many of us thought it would never eventuate....some dissapointed and some not, depending on the individuals expectations I suppose.
Anyway, looking forward to personally driving with the mods........
Thanks again all 4 your feedback
What's on your car at the moment?Quote:
Originally Posted by xiang