theres more hype/interest about this one come'n to aust than the hatch.............hahhaha
it'll happen for sure!!!.
So who wants to place bets on when? 18months?
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theres more hype/interest about this one come'n to aust than the hatch.............hahhaha
it'll happen for sure!!!.
So who wants to place bets on when? 18months?
hmmmmm, 18 months, sounds long but in a way reasonable....but come to think of it. when the FN2 was released here it seemed like it didn't take that long between the leaking of news to the actual release..........Quote:
Originally Posted by MKI4EVA
so maybe hopefully the FD2 will only take slightly long compared to the FN2......i really hope this thing comes to australia.
you guys reckon the insurance will be around the same as the FN2 if it comes??
Quote:
Originally Posted by killua888
from reading the other links in this thread I think we should expect very low volumes.............
wonder what look dealer would give if you walk in and ask to place a $500 deposit on one today.......hahahah.
So I'm guessing there are going to be a price increase for the JDM CTR....
It's the Honda Motor Company;any chance they can apply a hefty premium on a car ,THEY WILL.Quote:
Originally Posted by johnn
Quote:
Originally Posted by fasthonda
I can't imagine it being more than $47-$50K on road.
If I got the price of 2,835,000 YEN correct for the FD2,a straight out conversion is approx $28,200 AUS ,of course there are other costs involved such as transportation,duties etc.if it does come to Australia.Quote:
Originally Posted by MKI4EVA
It's a shame that Thailand is not geared up to produce Type Rs,because of the Free Trade agreement between the two countries and if Honda wasn't too greedy, we could probably buy the FD2 for about $43,000 on the road.
Part of the reason why the FD2R is quick and responsive is because of the team of dedicated Type R engineers working on it. They probably are the same guys who used to hand refine the DC5R, NSX and S2000 engines. If they were to make it in Thailand, they would need to send their engineers over to Thailand for long term if they wanted to keep the quality of the FD2R's mechanical parts up. Remember, it is not only the chassis strengthening of the FD2R that is different from the normal FD2. The engine has critical hand-tuned parts that require an experienced engineer to work on. They can't replace experience with machinery or cheaper fresh labour.Quote:
Originally Posted by fasthonda
wow do you think that the R's product is that labour intensive?
don't they just come off a production line with all the bits bolted on and 1 R formula for that production line?
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
I wish it was that easy. Then they could produce the FD2R at a quicker rate and meet the demand.Quote:
Originally Posted by MKI4EVA
This is what goes into the engine alone: http://asia.vtec.net/Engines/FD2K20AR/index.html
I just wonder if the turbo charged engines from eg Golf GTI,Megane Sport,XR5 etc go through as many processes as a Type R engine from a FD2R ,maybe taking the turbo route by some manufacturers is an easier and cheaper option?Quote:
Originally Posted by MKI4EVA
Someone with more indepth knowledge about engines maybe could answer.:confused:
It depends on the engine. Most engines are well built that they can take forced induction without many changes. But the engine in the GTI, Megane Sport and XR5 are designed from the ground up to be turbo engines. Of course, they would have balancing and everything, but the tolerances would not have to be as tight as that in a high-revving NA engine. Also, an NA engine is more sensitive to tuning methods such as balancing, lightening, polishing and ITB. Unfortunately, those are the more expensive types of tuning to do on an engine. For any engine, the amount of positive pressure supplied in the intake charge produces the most gains. Doing the same balancing, lightening and polishing would cost more for less power as compared to just designing the engine to be tougher in the first place and using forced induction. So when you look at both engines, the design and manufacturing cost is similar, but NA engines are more labour intensive to produce.Quote:
Originally Posted by fasthonda
To concur with aaron's comments. I went on the Porsche factory tour when they were assembling the Mk2 GT3's engine at the Stuttgart factory and they describe how much more labour intensive it is to produce the factory "specials". There was a separate section requiring dedicated "meisters" who would hand assemble, balance etc those engines that could not be done in the conventional production line.
In no way am I suggesting that Honda affords a similar proportion of their production budget in assembling Type R, but I would not be surprised at all if the costs to produce these cars are a LOT more than a standard Civic due to not being able to exploit economies of scale as a result of the customisation and specialist labour required to create the hardware that goes in to these cars. In that respect, paying $10-$15K more than a mainstream item is not an unreasonable ask. If anything, I suspect these cars make less profit for Honda as a product but is compensated for in the branding and awareness exposure.
Yes, the additional cost just to make an FD2R engine alone compared to a normal 147kW K20A would be similar to taking your k20a to a workshop and having it blueprinted, having I/H/E bolted on and reflashing your ECU. Even the header looks better than a Maximworks header, so don't use Xforce prices to calculate that. Calculate the cost and adjust for the cost of labour in Japan and you get a rough idea for the extra cost of the Type R engine.
Now, on to the chassis welding, bracing, suspension, bump/stroke sensors, dampers, springs, calipers, rotors, rims and tyres. $$$$$
have u got pictures of the headers? can i see them, i am very interested..Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
Here a screencap from Best Motoring:Quote:
Originally Posted by BlitZ
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/6...headerslx7.jpg
And here's the translated info on the headers from Honda Japan's website:
http://translate.google.com/translat...%3Den%26sa%3DG
came across this vid on what I assume was an FD2R press day at Suzuka. It's in Japanese, so don't really understand what he is saying (the only words I recognise are "fun" and "fast").
Interesting shot of the tyre's tread pattern and how widely the pattern (and compound?) varies across it's width.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycJUTiVOqjw
They are just RE070s.Quote:
Originally Posted by slipangle
http://www.honda.co.jp/CIVICTYPE-R/w.../potenza02.jpg
The new RE001 Adrenalins also vary the pattern across the width. It's how asymmetric tyres are designed.
yeah, on the vid, where the tyre was shown without the show shine/releasing agent(?) all over it, there is a clear difference in the tone of the rubber on the outer, less treaded edge as opposed to the middle and inner sections.
I think it's because of the increased tyre wear on the outer edges when you corner hard on the track.Quote:
Originally Posted by slipangle
They are still nothing special though. They are OEM tyres on the WRX STI since 2004.
i wonder how different a F20C engine is because the power output is much higher than that of the k20a
i'll add this in coz i got a kick outta watchin it.. its a lil off topic coz its a FN2 not the FD2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iq1Q...elated&search=
If you make a k20a rev as high as an F20C and use more aggressive cams suitable for that RPM, it should make more as shown by the early Spoon FD2 Civic that used the k20a combo (revving up to 10,000rpm)Quote:
Originally Posted by shinji112
No official word as yet but considering the FN2 is selling out shipments in advance and that Swindon is at maximum production (meaning they cant increas numbers commin in) matched with the JDM CTR being considerably cheaper than it's Brittish sister.. you never know..
one thing to consider though is that MY09 sees a completely new Jazz and Euro being released in Australia and so Honda might not want to interfear with the hype surrounding the release of these models.. so my prediction is IF the JDM CTR comes it will be in MY10 (late 2009).
MY10 would also see a facelifted Civic and so this might be a good time to introduce the 2nd Type R (JDM CTR) variant to give a boost to the promotion of the facelifted civics.
plus there's always old-school lobbying power.. if everyone that posted on here wrote a letter (not an email) to HONDA AUSTRALIA demanding they bring in the JDM CTR.. you never know what might happen.. Honda Australia is a already bit startled with the (Continued) success of the FD civic model and never expected such a response with the Type R.. so is a good sign of things to come from Honda in Aust.
Honda Australia wouldn't really care. The way Malaysia got theirs was the owner of Temple of VTEC Asia going up to the CEO of Honda Japan and asking for it (he was in Malaysia during the JGTC). The guy then arranged with Honda Malaysia to carry out a written survey on current Honda owners. It's not an easy petitioning process. There is much more to do in addition to that.
This is true, Wong (owner of temple of VTEC) really did fight for the JDM CTR to go to Malaysia. First response of Honda Japan is always "Look at the UKDM CTR instead as this is the model approved for your country". There are alot of justifications to do, and this is going to be an uphill challenge to bring in the JDM CTR.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
well it seems clear to me all we hafta do is fly over to japan and demand a meeting with the CEO of Honda Japan!!
geeeeeeeeeee that was such a herotic move of the Owner of Temple Vetc.
and the result is... a brand new page of the history.
awesome stuff
oz honda should do that
Ozhonda doesn't have any negotiation power. Temple of VTEC is huge. When new models come out in Malaysia, WongKN gets invited to launches and is also given a vehicle for a few days to review. Ozhonda is nowhere near that. We are just an enthusiast forum. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by sitta
http://www.vtec.net/forums/one-messa...page_number=3&
too nice....... I'm a malaysian but too bad God wanted me to have FD1 instead ...
looks like semi-slicks on that http://img457.imageshack.us/img457/4889/p2ov6.jpg
It's the RE070, OEM tyre for the STI.
Look Sooo Nice~!! would love hav a fd2R
man that car is sex on wheels.......
am i allowed to say sex here? lol
all the kiddies here go away:p
A very interesting article about what has been going on in Malaysia to get their FD2R;
http://asia.vtec.net/Reviews/8GCivicRLaunch/index.html
Some points of interest;
- The provision for the Aus spec DC5R at the factory had paved the way for Malaysia to consider a DC5R for their own market, but ultimately, in the 12th hour the pin was pulled. Maybe Malaysia's efforts in building a Malaysian model FD2R at the factory will pave the way for us to get the FD2R, if so, THANKS in advance!
- History about their refusal to accept the AUS spec DC5R in the Malaysian market, despite wanting a "Type R" at the time...although it seems that they wanted the JDM car, or nothing at all. Great attitude! (no sarcasm intended as I believe that you get what you settle for - and we shouldn't settle for a dilution of Honda's best efforts).
- It only took a survey of 6 Type R owners to make up a part of "completely thorough market research"(?!) to serve as a catalyst for the decision to be made to bring the FD2R over there, surely there would be a wider captive audience in Aus if Honda AUS/Japan wanting any convincing that there would be enough interested parties here!.
- There is a domestic series of racing in Malaysia which were campaigning Honda's cars, which is further mileage for Type R awareness. I don't think there is any official (4 wheeled) racing that Honda are involved in in Aus (not that I'm aware of anyway).
- Various mods that were made to comply for Malaysia, thankfully, none to the guts of the hardware.
- Notes about the fuel issues given Malaysia also does not have access to RON-100 fuel.
- Despite the exorbitant cost of these cars in Malaysia (esp relative to the average wage), they estimated that they would only sell 60 per annum. So far, they've sold 50 in the first month, currently with a 6 month waiting list.
:thumbsup:good postQuote:
Originally Posted by slipangle
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjgYBL8IET4
fn2r vs fd2r
JDM CTR won by 3 secs !!!! :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by d15z1SUX
it's time to bring this car onshore :honda::honda:
yeh it totally kicks butt lol
lol, that chick kicks ass too.....she'd prob whoop me around a track....
but then again her driving position is funny....so close
back to topic, fd2r is a mile ahead of fn2r......3seconds on a small track but imagine if that race took place on a larger track, the gap would have been way more.
should stop bringing in uk's and start bringing in some FD2R
unfortunately that's not going to happen in the short term i guess.Quote:
Originally Posted by BusterSonic12
they would probably have signed a contract to bring 1200 FN2 in and demand for FD2 is far over supply.
Honda video: FD2 driven by drift king
http://www.honda.co.jp/CIVICTYPE-R/t...suchiya-impre/
Great find!Quote:
Originally Posted by Philip Lee
Can someone with an understanding of Japanese interpret some of the points he makes?
Another interesting thing about the TOV article was Honda R&D's decision making in Japan being fairly independent of the marketing department (or at least less influenced by the bean counters/marketing to the extent of how they (R&D) believe how a Type R performance car should be made). I'm quite inclined to believe that given how the FD2R turned out!
it is refreshing to see a manufacturer who puts the product first. eventhough it's only limited to a model out of a range.
I'm staying loyal to the FN2. While the FD2 is 'crazy' it's not really suited to my style.
I guess the only bad news about bringing in the FD2 would only result in accelerated depreciation in FN2 values (or other Type Rs)
Keep an eye out on Carsales or Trading Post for an influx of DC5, FN2 and S2000s for sale when the FD2 comes out.
^ hope it really does come =) then it will be all sweet
If this thing comes out anything later than end of 2008.......do you think some ppl would have lost interest due to the model being around since 2006?
By then Evo 9's will be in the mid 30k range and people will be over the FD2R. It would probably still cost too much and too soon for grey imports to trickle in too. Personal import atm.Quote:
Originally Posted by MKI4EVA
The duties on private importing, if permitted, would be quite high thus rendering the FD2R unfeasible to import unless you're a die hard fan or just have too much money to burn.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nepolian
your allow to import FD2R if it is not for road use. like for Racing only.
then u can bring it in.
Are you an experienced importer? How much do you think it'll cost to bring one into Australia for racing only?Quote:
Originally Posted by BusterSonic12
^ i m not an importer LOL so not sure how much.
But the official spoon distributor "Pro Concept" which is a workshop, they are planning to bring in a FD2R to join their Pro Concept Racing team.
Right now they got a FD2R engine tho, ready to be transfer into one of the three EK4.
It's still feasible because the brand new FD2R RRP is only AU$29,000 in Japan. Even if you add in $10,000 worth of import duties and fees, it's still only $40,000.
Too bad it can't be registered for use on the road...
Yeah but if you really wanted to drive it on the road, just de-mod the exterior modifications and make it look like a stock civic sport :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by FN2TypeR
Hey bud, I can't help it but to comment on your avatar........do you realise honda under performed this year in F1? hehhehehhe jk.
hope they get back on their feet next season.
Good point about the EVO 9's being in the same price range by the time, if at all, the FD comes to play. Salivating at the day a R34 GTR is in the 30K bracket.
it might work out higher then $40k after duty,freight,insurance and GSTQuote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
technically speaking, would it be possible to buy an FD2R in Japan, strip the whole car minus chassis and bring over all the components for re-assembly into a normal FD in Australia?
the engine size would be the same if you purchase the sports model,so would this need to be engineered?
i don't think so. my friend have JDM Civic type-r in singapore. he only mods air intake system but cause car unbalance and under power.Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffske
once he removed the air intake, everything back to normal.told by mech, civic type-r already engineered and balance as full whole integrated system.
but you would only be using the Australian chassis and the rest of the car will be the JDM ctrQuote:
Originally Posted by dmx
depends on chassis mods, on the type r chassis compared to the aus spec.
without the type R chassis its nothing, wont handle as good even if u have everything.
if u just after the power might as well stick the k20 from dc5r in or turbo it etc.
isnt it the exact same chassis? i thought the "FD2" denoted the chassis styleQuote:
Originally Posted by xqwzit
so if both cars use the FD2 prefix then they're the same
can someone confirm?
chassis style but doesn't mean they are the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffske
ek Vti-r and ek Type r chassis are different.
FD is more referring to the shape.
The FD2R would have alot more welds to make it more rigid. just like the ek9 compared to ek4.
edit: correct me if im wrong but im pretty sure
^that's what I thought as well, if its called FD2R, it should have the same chassis. Same goes to EK9 and the EK4, the chassis are different therefore have different codes. However, I won't be surprised if the FD2R has better Welding... etc.
Encor, the VTi-R and Type R have different chasis, hence EK9 and EK4, but now it is FD2 and FD2R
fd2r chassis is more strengthened, tougher
someone can confirm i might be wrong :)
yup that is true, as if standard fd chassis will be as strong as the type rQuote:
Originally Posted by xqwzit
haha thanks
if its exactly the same chassis everyone can just get the suspension setup and handle like one :P
The Brits are getting it :(
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/272082.htm
the Brits are getting it via private imports.
the FD2R chassis is modded from the factory. it is stiffer in some area (refer to the red points) and lighter in others (refer to the orange points). full detail on the link below:
http://www.honda.co.jp/CIVICTYPE-R/webcatalog/body/
yeah u cant go to a honda dealer in UK and order one.
we can get FD2R in Perth ;-)
Perth Dealer
Ha! :D If only it were that easy...Quote:
Originally Posted by lukits01
lol i was excited in the time it took that page to load
Quote:
Originally Posted by lukits01
Litchfield Imports in UK still gives a 3 year warranty on their grey-imported FD2R though. It's not like the import market here in Australia which is full of dodgy practices, even when importing a brand new car (you probably lose parts in between leaving japan and reaching your door).
The body shell of the new Civic Type 'R' has been especially developed to give maximum rigidity and whilst over 50% more rigid than the Integra is only 1.8kg more in weight!!Quote:
Originally Posted by xqwzit
if i now wrong, no other country have JDM CTR from the official dealer.ie. Singapore, UK, Malaysia, Indonesia, and Hong Kong. all from private importer.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronng
wow... not expecting australia also has doggy importer, tought only in Asian Country:thumbdwn:
ok, lets say, same chassis, anyone dare to import the whole parts (just minus body shell and chassis) :confused::confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by CoupeTurbo
you are indeed wrong. Malaysia has official FD2R. http://www.honda.com.my/models/civicTypeR.cfmQuote:
Originally Posted by dmx
^yup... Malaysia is the only country outside Japan to officially get the FD2R
WOW that place can get the new r35 GTR as wellQuote:
Originally Posted by lukits01