B16A in CRX '88 running slow any ideas?

Hey Guys,

I recently purchased a CRX Gen II 88 with a b16a engine swap.

I have been told that the engine came out of a 98 civic vti, so i was wondering what type of b16a do i have and how much kw/hp should it have?

i looked on the engine, it simply says 'b16a' not a2 or anything like that.

Also, i have an apexi vtec controller, but i get the feeling it isnt tuned right, as the car is getting molested by my mates dc2 vtir. My crx is completly stripped, and we both know how to drive. I should be walking away yeah?

Any reason why my car would be running so slow...what should i check out and fix to isolate the issues?

Many thanks,

skiiboy90.

B16A

JDM Integra
ED9 is it? = JDM CRX SiR
EF9 = Civic SiR
JDM EK4 = Civic VTi-R

came out of either one of those...

curtiousy of wikipedia

B16A

Note: All JDM B16A engines are stamped 'B16A' (with no number after the "A" to identify version).

* VTEC
* Found in:
o 1988-1991 JDM Honda Integra RSi/XSi (DA6/DA8)
o 1988-1991 JDM Honda CRX SiR (EF8)
o 1988-1991 JDM Honda Civic SiR (EF9)
+ Displacement: 1,595 cc (97.3 cu in) 1.6 liter
+ Compression: 10.2:1
+ Bore: 81.0 mm (3.2 in)
+ Rod/stroke ratio: 77.4 mm
+ Power: 158 hp (118 kW) @ 7600 rpm & 111 ft·lbf (150 N·m) @ 7000 rpm
+ Transmission: S1/J1/Y1
+ Redline: 8200 rpm
o 1992-1996 JDM Honda CR-X del Sol SiR (EG2)
o 1992-2000 JDM Honda Civic SiRII (EG6/EG9/EK4)
+ Displacement: 1,595 cc (97.3 cu in)
+ Compression: 10.4:1
+ Power: 170 hp (130 kW) @ 7800 rpm & 116 ft·lbf (157 N·m) @ 7300 rpm
+ Valve Lift: IN 10.7 mm (0.42 in), EX 9.4 mm (0.37 in)
+ Inlet Valve Diamter: 33 by 2 millimetres (1.3 in × 0.079 in)
+ Transmission: S4C/Y21 (Some with LSD)
+ Redline: 8200 rpm




whats actually happening??? is vtec engaging? theyre a pretty quick motor
and being in a CRX you shouldnt be getting left too far behind if anything at all...

i suggest either removing the vtec controller as theyre basically pointless unless
your hardcore worked and/or see the track at least once a month...

Get I/H/E done all so perhaps??

check compressions
check plugs
check leads
check timing
use only PREMIUM fuel i.e V-Power, Caltex Vortex, BP Ultimate...

im interested in this topic as a mate of mine has a b16 but aus spec A2 but it doesnt pull it hit vtec on first switch but after that it feels the same...... and it revs up to 9400 but is useless, ive checked the ecu.. its a standard ecu...

get rid of vtec controller and check out plugs do service etc and check for cel codes (cel codes in crx is on passenger side under the carpet jst pull it bak if theres codes should be blinking then jst check it out on the diy section its a sticky should find the problem .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by duckey

im interested in this topic as a mate of mine has a b16 but aus spec A2 but it doesnt pull it hit vtec on first switch but after that it feels the same...... and it revs up to 9400 but is useless, ive checked the ecu.. its a standard ecu...

---

Standard ECU with a revcut at 9400 lol? :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chr1s

Standard ECU with a revcut at 9400 lol? :rolleyes:

---

yes i know very weird aye?

Real rev limit is probably 8500 or 8700; I don't think it's too far fetched to say the stock tacho could be out by 5-10%.

Check your plugs, base timing, all the usual "tune-up" things.

compression test it.

What dose the Block serial number start with?

Cable clutch?

Build dates stamped on the head anyway

I have the SiR ll out of an 93 EG6 170hp/125kw and she feels very punchy

Hydro clutch
Block Serial start with 5xxxx
Transmission: S4C

Ready this http://hybrid.honda-perf.org/tech/b16a/

And for gods sack loose the VTec controller!!! Honda knows exactly where the VTec crossover point should be...

if i get the vtec controller profesionally tuned, will it be better than the stock ecu guys?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lukezen27

What dose the Block serial number start with?

Cable clutch?

Build dates stamped on the head anyway

I have the SiR ll out of an 93 EG6 170hp/125kw and she feels very punchy

Hydro clutch
Block Serial start with 5xxxx
Transmission: S4C

Ready this http://hybrid.honda-perf.org/tech/b16a/

And for gods sack loss the VTec controller!!! Honda knows exactly where the VTec crossover point should be...

---

very good link :thumbsup::thumbsup:

if the engine is internally stock,ie no big cams,head work,compression changes,etc,then the best place for the vtec xover point is where the stock ecu will do it in any case.

the vtec controller setting/wiring,etc could be causing the problems u describe,so the first thing i would be doing is taking it out to eliminate that as a possible fault.

if engine is stock,u dont need it & really shouldnt have it anywhere near your car if u value it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skiiboy90

if i get the vtec controller profesionally tuned, will it be better than the stock ecu guys?

---

no remove, sell


or get the motor rebuilt with forged internals, stage 3 cams, I/H/E ITB's perhaps???
then use your VTEC controller :)

even then you dnt need it because an aftermarket computer should control it LOL

ok cool u guys have convinced me!

I had a look and its spliced into the wires running to the ecu. If i simply snip them from the stock wiring, will i be able to start my car??

I also have an immoboliser, its a pain in the ass to start.

Immoboliser has to be pressed with special prong tool twice, then turn on ignition, wait for apexi to load, then start the car.

will i experience problems if i take apexi out?

cheers.

BTW thanks for all the help so far guys. Riviera to answer your questions - yes vtec is engaging, at 5500 according to apexi.

Ok so by basically everyones input - apexi vtec controller is useless. Why do people get them then? is it only for really worked engines? Also how does the vtec controller hinder performance.....?

Also, once i get it running off stock ecu, do plugs leads timing all small things etc, can i get it tuned somewhere locally to get it runnin optimally? will it make a difference?

ill check build date, numbers etc tomorrow and let you all know.

I appreciate all the help so far guys thanks heaps keep the input coming!

:D

make sure you come over to crxaustralia to while your at it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by A.C.S DRAG

make sure you come over to crxaustralia to while your at it.

---

I have tried twice man admin wont confirm my login. any ideas?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skiiboy90

BTW thanks for all the help so far guys. Riviera to answer your questions - yes vtec is engaging, at 5500 according to apexi.

Ok so by basically everyones input - apexi vtec controller is useless. Why do people get them then? is it only for really worked engines? Also how does the vtec controller hinder performance.....?

Also, once i get it running off stock ecu, do plugs leads timing all small things etc, can i get it tuned somewhere locally to get it runnin optimally? will it make a difference?

ill check build date, numbers etc tomorrow and let you all know.

I appreciate all the help so far guys thanks heaps keep the input coming!

:D

---

No tuning is needed or possible once your running the stock ECU with all the other useless crap removed.

Just reset the ECU by removing the ECU fuse in the fuse box under the hood for about 5 seconds.. replace and off you go

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lukezen27

No tuning is needed or possible once your running the stock ECU with all the other useless crap removed.

Just reset the ECU by removing the ECU fuse in the fuse box under the hood for about 5 seconds.. replace and off you go

---

Thanks Luke.

Just wondering if anyone knows the answer to this:

ok cool u guys have convinced me to take out my vtec controller!

I had a look and its spliced into the wires running to the ecu. If i simply snip them from the stock wiring, will i be able to start my car??

I also have an immoboliser, its a pain in the ass to start.

Immoboliser has to be pressed with special prong tool twice, then turn on ignition, wait for apexi to load, then start the car.

will i experience problems if i take apexi out?

and also how much are apexi's worth these days?

does it just say apexi vtec controller?

Or does it say apexi vafc???

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Webby_roller

does it just say apexi vtec controller?

Or does it say apexi vafc???

---

It says: "VAFCII Vtec Control Airflow Converter"

Blue LCD Screen with control know on the Right Hand Side.....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lukezen27

What dose the Block serial number start with?

Cable clutch?

Build dates stamped on the head anyway

I have the SiR ll out of an 93 EG6 170hp/125kw and she feels very punchy

Hydro clutch
Block Serial start with 5xxxx
Transmission: S4C

Ready this http://hybrid.honda-perf.org/tech/b16a/

And for gods sack loose the VTec controller!!! Honda knows exactly where the VTec crossover point should be...

---

ok my serial number stamped on the block is: 5016763 "B16A"............... :)

and where is the build date that is stamped on the head? which side? i couldnt find it... :(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skiiboy90

It says: "VAFCII Vtec Control Airflow Converter"

Blue LCD Screen with control know on the Right Hand Side.....

---

Leave it in untill you replace it with a standalone ecu,
Go & see someone who knows how to tune it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TODA AU

Leave it in untill you replace it with a standalone ecu,
Go & see someone who knows how to tune it.

---

cant i just revert back to the stock ecu that it is wired into?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skiiboy90

It says: "VAFCII Vtec Control Airflow Converter"

Blue LCD Screen with control know on the Right Hand Side.....

---

u should have said vafc in the first post,big difference to just saying vtec controller.

in that case leave it in & get it tuned,but consider taking it out if your not gonna get it tuned.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skiiboy90

cant i just revert back to the stock ecu that it is wired into?

---

u can

just have to cut the wires going to the vafc,but u have to join the vtec & map sensor wire back together for the stock ecu.

at least with it out of the car u will be able to get the car running mechanically right,then put it back in & tune it,or sell it & get that standalone it seems u r after.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CRXer

u can

just have to cut the wires going to the vafc,but u have to join the vtec & map sensor wire back together for the stock ecu.

at least with it out of the car u will be able to get the car running mechanically right,then put it back in & tune it,or sell it & get that standalone it seems u r after.

---

with the standalone, will i see big power improvements? I have headers, catback, and pod. Nothing major, but yeah. I should get away with just using the stock ecu yeah? im not gonna do internals or anything like that....

i figure stock ecu is a good idea as honda woulda spent big $$$ making the best point to make power for the vtec to kick in yeah?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skiiboy90

with the standalone, will i see big power improvements? I have headers, catback, and pod. Nothing major, but yeah. I should get away with just using the stock ecu yeah? im not gonna do internals or anything like that....

i figure stock ecu is a good idea as honda woulda spent big $$$ making the best point to make power for the vtec to kick in yeah?

---

You'll see improvements once your vafc tuned correctly but not huge gains and thats a big difference to a VTec controller by the way lol

Anyway ether remove completely and get your car running right as CRXer has stated or go to someone who knows what there doing as Adrian (TODA) has stated.

I'd say if your able to, remove the crap and put everything back to stock and see if that fixing everything..

If fixed leave it till you can afford a good tune and have the vafc re-installed by them at that point..

Head stamp date, Photo thanks to Ben
http://images.geekazoids.net/datestamp.jpg

u will never see "big" improvements to a honda series motor with just bolt on gear & a bit of tuning. There is slight improvements to be had,depending on the quality of gear bolted to the motor & the quality of the tuner tuning the standalone.u really have to do some internal work to see big improvements.

u really also only need a standalone when doing internal work or boosting the motor.

if cash is an issue,considering u already have the vafc,just make sure your motor is running properly on the stock ecu,then reintroduce the vafc & get it tuned properly by a reputable honda tuner,like TODA above.

EDIT: shut up luke,stop copying what i say then posting it before me lol.

to the OP.

stop thinking a stock crx with b16a is going to give you ballistic performance.

its a 1.6 4cyl. get a reality check please.

sure its a nice point and squirt car. I know cos i have a crx with b16a.

but please don't think its gonna give you drag car performance.

To me it sounds like your engine is fine..... (the vibe i'm getting from reading this thread)

It also sounds like you're expecting too much out of your car.

solution - save up and buy a faster car.

thanks for all the help guys, like i said im new to the honda world.

I just say i get the feeling the b16a isnt running 100% because im not keepin up with my mate in his stock dc2 integra. should i be beating him or at least close?!

im aware its not going to be a rocketsled but by the same token i want it to be running as good as possible.....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skiiboy90

cant i just revert back to the stock ecu that it is wired into?

---

Yes, all that need to be done is to initialize the unit.
Then it will have no effect.

No need to cut any wires...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TODA AU

Yes, all that need to be done is to initialize the unit.
Then it will have no effect.

No need to cut any wires...

---

yeh but adrian,how can u eliminate that a faulty unit could be passing thru a dud MAP signal?

not saying ive ever heard or seen this happen,but id be at least rejoining the MAP wire & getting the car running properly,then reintroduce any extras.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CRXer

u can

just have to cut the wires going to the vafc,but u have to join the vtec & map sensor wire back together for the stock ecu.

at least with it out of the car u will be able to get the car running mechanically right,then put it back in & tune it,or sell it & get that standalone it seems u r after.

---

ok awesome, what colour / how do i find these 2 wires to connect back together....

Thanks!

try reseting the vafc as TODA said to default values,if there is no improvement in car then,

-trace the vafc wiring to where it joins onto the ecu wiring
-u will see most of the wires join onto the ecu wiring,but 2 wires to the ecu have been cut & rerouted into vafc.
-u can leave most of the wiring attached,but just find the white wire,remove the 2 wires leading to vafc from this white wire & rejoin the white wire that has been cut(so that it goes straight to the ecu as it did originally) & make sure it is a good join.

if car runs better now,then u know the vafc is faulty or the joins in the above wire were faulty.

if car still running shit,then u have to look further into the problem.

once car is running good again,then u can reintroduce the vafc & get it tuned professionally.

why dont u take it somewhere with a dyno get a power run and log the air fuel. kills two birds with one stone. will confirm whether your car down on power and see whether the vafc has been set up properly.

great thanks for all your advice guys!