Urgent help! distributor has no spark??

hi all.

had my car for a valve adjustment and new spark and valve seals replaced. but the strangest thing was, after it was all done. my car wont start.

i went to the mech today, and he showed me.

the dizzy had no sparks coming out ONLY when the cover is on....

we pulled the cover off and it sparks fine!

we thought might be the covers or rotors fault. so all new parts were replaced, yet still same problem??

obviously my old dizzy wasn't at fault. so what could be the problem??

they is enough voltage going into my dizzy (11.2 something...more than enough)

please help asap thanks!!

the problem is ur mechanic lol

i really doubt it andy, he is pretty good with hondas.

anyone ?

could it be my immobilizer?

I don't think its the immobiliser because if it was armed, then in theory you shouldn't even be able to start the starter motor.

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Originally Posted by EK4R

hi all.

had my car for a valve adjustment and new spark and valve seals replaced. but the strangest thing was, after it was all done. my car wont start.

i went to the mech today, and he showed me.

the dizzy had no sparks coming out ONLY when the cover is on....

we pulled the cover off and it sparks fine!

we thought might be the covers or rotors fault. so all new parts were replaced, yet still same problem??

obviously my old dizzy wasn't at fault. so what could be the problem??

they is enough voltage going into my dizzy (11.2 something...more than enough)

please help asap thanks!!

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you mean the dizzy cover ? IE cap and rotor ?
did you replace the cap itself ? (it has 4 connections inside that contact the rotor , and send the spark to each spark lead thent he spark plug 1 at a time)

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Originally Posted by kyle

I don't think its the immobiliser because if it was armed, then in theory you shouldn't even be able to start the starter motor.

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depends what it is immobilising.. a immobiliser is just a circuit breaker really

does the car crank but wont turn over?

check your timing as if this is way off you will get no spark!!

it could either be too advanced or vise versa!!

i've had the same problem when engine conversion was done and no spark but cranks.!! checked the timing and wala!! fixed!!

try this and see how u go ...

**immobilizer wont affect ignition spark... but can disable the starter /fuel <-- even then this has nothing to do with "no sparks"***

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Originally Posted by bennjamin

you mean the dizzy cover ? IE cap and rotor ?
did you replace the cap itself ? (it has 4 connections inside that contact the rotor , and send the spark to each spark lead thent he spark plug 1 at a time)

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yes once the plastic cover on the dizzy is put on. no spark would come out.
we tested this with one of his tools which looks like a screwdriver with a tube. the tube would spark when the dizzy starts to turn.

the cap is working and a new one was even replaced. still same problem.

whats funny is, when the cover is off. we tested each connectors with the tool and they was spark!!

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Originally Posted by XB-16-AX

does the car crank but wont turn over?

check your timing as if this is way off you will get no spark!!

it could either be too advanced or vise versa!!

i've had the same problem when engine conversion was done and no spark but cranks.!! checked the timing and wala!! fixed!!

try this and see how u go ...

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well wouldn't timing always be the same with or without the distributor's cover on or off?

it turns over and HAVE sparks with the cap OFF. but with the cap ON, it turns but NO spark :confused:

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Originally Posted by EK4R

well wouldn't timing always be the same with or without the distributor's cover on or off?

it turns over and HAVE sparks with the cap OFF. but with the cap ON, it turns but NO spark :confused:

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its weird how its the dizzy cover, have u got another dizzy cover and tried it? and if its still the same then there is definately something wrong there..

have u got ur leads checked?

the timing could be affected during the vavle adjustment.. and could possibly affected the dizzy.

as i said if the timing is wrong u wont get spark ...dont know if this applies to the dizzy cap off (as in ur case u get spark.) :rolleyes:

hmmm

^^ exactly, i mean i doubt its timing if the dizzy has spark with the cover off??

and yes tried new cap and leads and rotor....

if you look inside your dizzy cap in the centre there should be a spring loaded peice of carbon. this touches the rotor and distributes the spark to the leads.

make sure yours is not missing or stuck. it should be touching the rotor when the cap is in place.

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Originally Posted by ECU-MAN

if you look inside your dizzy cap in the centre there should be a spring loaded peice of carbon. this touches the rotor and distributes the spark to the leads.

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also,you say you have replaced the dizzy cap.It's good practice to scrape a little bit away from the carbon piece when u install the new cap to make sure you will get a good contact. You might want to scrape away any buildup on the contacts in the dizzy too,but i suppose they must be ok if you have spark when the caps off.weird problem.goodluck

thx for all the replies.
im going to the mech tomorrow to do a little fiddle myself and hopefully it will run . will keep this updated.

btw. this problem only occured straight after i had my valve adjusted and my spark O ring replaced (so im guessing sparks might of been pulled out during the change. could these two things be the cause of my problem?

Why did you have the valves adjusted ???

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Originally Posted by Civic Type R

Why did you have the valves adjusted ???

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cos its ticking under my hood. and apparently its way off . lucky it was loose not tight.

ticking ???
What did you do to the B18 ??

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Originally Posted by Civic Type R

ticking ???
What did you do to the B18 ??

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i drove it...

its ticking under the hood so i asked for a tappet adjustment. and he said its the same thing

u sure its not something else ticking george? I can think of something else which it could be that makes some sense with this spark issue

speak to ur mechanic about it more, he really should be the one doing the worrying here for you

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Originally Posted by pornstar

u sure its not something else ticking george? I can think of something else which it could be that makes some sense with this spark issue

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what may that be andy?

Also, remember that is one carefully blueprinted hi-end engine built by a proven performance workshop. Its not your typical JDM B18cR !

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Originally Posted by Civic Type R

Also, remember that is one carefully blueprinted hi-end engine built by a proven performance workshop. Its not your typical JDM B18cR !

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haha adam. yea its not even a b18c. its b18. one of a kind :zip:

though i duno why the valve were adjust soo off? it should be the same as normal b18 wouldnt it

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Originally Posted by EK4R

haha adam. yea its note even a b18c. its b18.

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Yes, there is a reason for that ;)

just make sure he didnt remove the dizzy drive and put it back on 180deg out

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Originally Posted by ECU-MAN

just make sure he didnt remove the dizzy drive and put it back on 180deg out

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?? whats that. would this affect sparks not being produced once the cover is put back on?

i just came back from the mechanics, he said he did a full test on all the dizzy parts as well as engine and all my fuse to check for grounding , resisitance or any signs of power loss. nothing.

he even boosted my battery just incase, still nothing. we checked the rotation of the rotor and it sparks on everything turn. timing was correct also.

he measured the displacment of my carbon piece on the inside of my cover as well as the spring which sends the power from the dizzy. they all come in contact with my cap.

each 4 connectors on my cap were checked for resistance got only got a rating of 0.01

he said the only thing he could think of is my alarm immoboiliser or a wire is broken. tomorrow a auto electrician will come and inspect the car and the alarm system.

..strange

the alarm should have 2 or 3 point immobl. - dizzy being one of them -
have you swapped with a good known dizzy yet to see ?
&#196;lso check in your engine bay fuse box for the 80a or 100a fuse (at the front of the box) - it can break under load or shorts and give you the problem you face here too

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Originally Posted by bennjamin

the alarm should have 2 or 3 point immobl. - dizzy being one of them -
have you swapped with a good known dizzy yet to see ?

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we used a dizzy off my mechanic's car which was the same and in near new condition. same thing happened. as well as new leads, coil, cover, rotor etc

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Originally Posted by EK4R

we used a dizzy off my mechanic's car which was the same and in near new condition. same thing happened. as well as new leads, coil, cover, rotor etc

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cool -

tested/swapped your main relay yet ?

Tried to remove excess fuel in the chambers ? ( might of flooded)

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Originally Posted by bennjamin

cool -

tested/swapped your main relay yet ?

Tried to remove excess fuel in the chambers ? ( might of flooded)

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i believe he said he has tested the relay and it was fine.

as for excess fuel. ill ask him tomorrow, but how would this affect my spark not being produced once the cover is on?

they is no spark only when the cap is placed over the distributor. they is spark without the plastic cap.

note: the test was done via a checker tool that would spark once the rotor started turning. the checker tool is placed one of the four connectors on the cap and one end grounded to the chassis

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Originally Posted by EK4R

i believe he said he has tested the relay and it was fine.

as for excess fuel. ill ask him tomorrow, but how would this affect my spark not being produced once the cover is on?

they is no spark only when the cap is placed over the distributor. they is spark without the plastic cap.

note: the test was done via a checker tool that would spark once the rotor started turning. the checker tool is placed one of the four connectors on the cap and one end grounded to the chassis

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sorry didnt browse thru most of the thread - jsut stating the obvious checks.

Excess fuel = flooded , and the spark plugs are pretty much coated with fuel and cannot ignite. Take out each sparkplug , and disconnect the dizzy + fuel pump and turn to car over a few times and hopefully abit of mist / gunk will fly out. Or more so to air out the cylinders.


Did you try the basic test with a spare spark plug ? Plug in a spark plug into one of the spark leads , ground it to the head or the chassis and turn it over to see if any spark ?

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Originally Posted by bennjamin

sorry didnt browse thru most of the thread - jsut stating the obvious checks.

Excess fuel = flooded , and the spark plugs are pretty much coated with fuel and cannot ignite. Take out each sparkplug , and disconnect the dizzy + fuel pump and turn to car over a few times and hopefully abit of mist / gunk will fly out. Or more so to air out the cylinders.


Did you try the basic test with a spare spark plug ? Plug in a spark plug into one of the spark leads , ground it to the head or the chassis and turn it over to see if any spark ?

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ah ok well here is the thing. our problem isnt with the sparks not working, its no spark at all from the distributor.

we didnt test the sparks when the leads are on. we tested if the sparks are coming out of the cap connectors by using a checker tool.

the tool is basically a screwdriver with a tube that ignite when sparks fly out.

so when the rotor turns and hits the connector which the checker tool is attached to, it would spark.

BTW, the car has a standard Honda fitted immobiliser and a Laserline top of the range Alarm. If you need help with that yo need to go to a Laserline alarm service ctr in Melb.

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Originally Posted by Civic Type R

BTW, the car has a standard Honda fitted immobiliser and a Laserline top of the range Alarm. If you need help with that yo need to go to a Laserline alarm service ctr in Melb.

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wouldn't the immoboiliser stop the dizzy from turning over ?? or just stop it sparking...?

cos my dizzy is turning over, just no spark once the cap is put on

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Originally Posted by EK4R

wouldn't the immoboiliser stop the dizzy from turning over ?? or just stop it sparking...?

cos my dizzy is turning over, just no spark once the cap is put on

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The immobilizer will stop the signal sent to the dizzy to ignite the fuel mixture.

The dizzy WILL turn over when the car turns over , regardless.


Remember , the dizzy is connected directly to the (inlet) camshaft , which is connected directly to the timing belt which is connected directly to the crank , which is connected directly to the rods and thus pistons. All of which "move in union" when you try to start the car.

If it was an imobilisor fault you wouldnt have spark with the cap off?? you need a new mechanic, this guy sounds dodgy.

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Originally Posted by creativepunka

If it was an imobilisor fault you wouldnt have spark with the cap off?? you need a new mechanic, this guy sounds dodgy.

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yea thats what i thought. al good.

he said he will try a new ignitor tmrw and hopefully it will be powerfully enough.

are they different types of ignitions?? or they all the same with EKs

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Originally Posted by EK4R

yea thats what i thought. al good.

he said he will try a new ignitor tmrw and hopefully it will be powerfully enough.

are they different types of ignitions?? or they all the same with EKs

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you need the igniter to suit your distributor - OBD2 version

George, how did you go with the contact I gave you yesterday ?

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Originally Posted by Civic Type R

George, how did you go with the contact I gave you yesterday ?

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na im going to call them today if the ignitor dont work.

im pm u anyways now

who is the mech that u went to for this to happen?

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Originally Posted by alan

who is the mech that u went to for this to happen?

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na rather keep it quiet. he is pretty good and knows his stuff, just this time, its a werid one. never came across this

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Originally Posted by EK4R

na rather keep it quiet. he is pretty good and knows his stuff,

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you sure about that .. Im not !

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Originally Posted by Civic Type R

you sure about that .. Im not !

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ease up guys I'm sure he's a good mechanic.So many times one little thing can go wrong that might not even be the mechanics fault but they are the easies person to blame

teh mechanic, its my old car and I put too much time and effort into it, that I dont want to see it playing up as much as anyone else.

UPDATE ~ still got the same problem. no spark out of the distributor cap once its placed back on.

anyways i got a wire diagram. highlighted in blue is where my spark is coming from. area in green is where the spark is meant to be distributed to, however im not getting anything there.

could my problems be in any of the areas highlighted in red?

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m99/gxiang/diz1.jpg

can you take a picture of the inside of the distributer cap?

Maybe the spring that holds the pickup in contact came off?

also the red parts shouldn't affect any of your problems, the problem lies on the angled line that connects the 2 green circled parts. Or more correctly where that line contacts to the ignition wires.

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Originally Posted by kyle

can you take a picture of the inside of the distributer cap?

Maybe the spring that holds the pickup in contact came off?

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i will go down to the mech and take a photo when i get a chance. would you have a picture of what it looks like inside the cap ?

lol, it goes in the coil.
there should be a spring, that contacts with the cap.
i told you to check the coil.
lol.

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Originally Posted by destrukshn

lol, it goes in the coil.
there should be a spring, that contacts with the cap.
i told you to check the coil.
lol.

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that spring from the ignition is still there.

the mech measured all the components inside the cap as well as the spring and distance apart. and the rotor button. it was all perfect.

Couldn't find one but looking here, on the 'top' picture in the centre of rotor, a spring connects a pickup to it. http://69.0.158.19/live/F202033842BOS.JPG

its not spring that contact that. its a peice of spring loaded carbon from the centre of the dizzy cap.

if the the cap was interefing with the sensors in the red circle then the ecu would output a fault code. just make sure that the dizzy cap is not squashing any wires from the ICM that controls the RPM signal.

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Originally Posted by ECU-MAN

its not spring that contact that. its a peice of spring loaded carbon from the centre of the dizzy cap.

if the the cap was interefing with the sensors in the red circle then the ecu would output a fault code. just make sure that the dizzy cap is not squashing any wires from the ICM that controls the RPM signal.

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yes thats what i thought also. the only spring i can see is coming from the ignition coil. the middle part of the cap is attached via a carbon piece that sticks out. Even if they not are in contact, the sparks would jump across the short distance,providing they is spark going there...

if you have tried another GOOD known dizzy - and it gets the same problem... doesnt this mean the issue is FURTHER back down the wiring loom somewhere ? not the dizzy itself ?

Are you sure he plugged the dizzy harness back in? LOL Man your Mech sounds Ghet. Get someone knowledgeable from your area on this forum(rare) to come look at it.