ECU discussion for Honda Cars

[JDM.Power]

as title states im in a situation where i need an aftermarket computer for my K series.

and i need some good information and guidelines
about a EMS 4424 stinger V4,
im wondering if this would hook up into my EG K swap,
i have a stock prb ecu. but im looking to upgrade abit.
kpro atm is out of the question with the prices so high, and no need.
in need of a ecu that can cover all the basics, which any ecu can.
but someone has offered me a ems ecu, and im wondering if this would be plug and play or would i have to make a harness to get it connected?

if anyone wishes to ask what ecu to run on your car or need help, just post along and im sure someone can help out.

[aaronng]

Doubt this EMS ECU can adjust VTC on the K20a.

[EfiOz]

Correct. Stingers won't do iVTEC. ABout all that's up to that application is EFI Euro1 or Motec.

[JDM.Power]

thanks guys,

[aaronng]

Correct. Stingers won't do iVTEC. ABout all that's up to that application is EFI Euro1 or Motec.

Yeah, which makes Kpro the most direct and economical route, especially after you factor in tuning costs.

[EfiOz]

Yeah, KPro is a killer in the bang for your buck stakes.

[Chris_F]

what everyone else has said is correct... to have full tuneability of the k-series your cheapest option is still going to be Hondata.

Motec, EFI and Vi-pec/Link are your other options, but once you have either of these wired in etc. they will be more expensive than hondata

[Slugman]

Err, I don't want to nit-pick too much, as the end result is the same, but from the 4424 pdf that I am looking at right now, on page 54 is an example of using one of the outputs to control a shift light, which is essentially the same as activating the vtec solenoid. I am currently using an 8860 on a B18C (Which works), & both the 4424 & the 8860 will technically work, as long as you don't care about whether you have enough oil pressure, oil/engine temperature, throttle % etc that the standard ECU guards you against.

However, my advice is to not use either of them, even if you are getting the 4424 for free, for a heap of reasons which are too long to go into here. If I had to do it all again, I would go standard ECU with Hondata.

[EfiOz]

That would run a conventional VTEC arrangement which is really just an on/off switch (we've had customers with steering wheel override switches for use in hillclimbing events) but the iVTEC system needs a proper PWM output to control the camshaft angle by manipulating oil pressure into the variator from reading coded camshaft wheel and comparing it to a camshaft position map.

Get that wrong and you'll have a head full of bent valves.

[Slugman]

OK, just very briefly delving into smart-bum mode to say that PWM modes are on page 58, which is PWM vs RPM or KPA or Throttle % or Idle Control, but (Returning to helpful mode) I agree, it's not worth blowing up the motor to learn how to do it, & unfortunately that really is the whole point - The 4424 & 8860 really can do pretty much anything, with any car, in any configuration, as long as you don't want any safety controls, but the customer assistance is almost zero, & you have to be an expert to get any use out of the thing. I nearly cut mine up with a sledge hammer in frustration. Go Hondata.
Oh, BTW, I was not aware of the difference in the iVTEC vs the normal VTEC, so thanks! (I will scurry back to the Noob area now )

[EfiOz]

There is still no position control for the camshaft. A PID control (or at least PI) is needed for the actual camshaft position otherwise oil quality and temperature, wear and tear in the variator will give incorrect advance positions. There is also no calculation for the actual camshaft position which is essential for the controller to do it's job.

It's not an issue of safety controls. It's an issue of using the correct controller and that feature does not exist at present in either the 4424 or 8860.