redline 5w30 synthetic $11-12 per litre suitable for 2012 euro?

**pitiek** · 09-04-2012 12:22 PM

You beat me to it Freedops..!!

**EuroGraphite** · 09-04-2012 03:40 PM

Have you changed your oil to the RL 5w30 yet pitiek?

**pitiek** · 09-04-2012 06:44 PM

Not yet..
My 10k service is due in July, I will do it then.
I had my warranty extended when I purchased my CU2 and one of the condition was I need to get my car serviced by the same dealer which doesn't really bother me.
I assume they won't deny warranty if I ask them to put Redline instead of the crappy Honda FEO.

**EuroGraphite** · 12-04-2012 08:10 PM

My redline oil has just arrived! Less than a week to be delivered to my door...impressive!

I called up my local honda service center and asked about changing my oil at the 1000km mark. He sounded surprised (even more so when I also said I wanted to change the oil filter, and providing my own oil) but said it wouldn't be a problem at all. At my current rate of km's, I will schedule my service for next weekend.

I am not expecting a huge difference in performance this time round, and a Group 5 synthetic is definitely overkill in a mildly driven honda euro. But considering this oil is costing the about the same as the standard honda feo, it won't sting the pocket too much.

Will report back once its done!

**EuroGraphite** · 12-04-2012 08:20 PM

On a slightly different note, the Redline oil is not API certified. Although it meets all the performance requirements, RL has a higher concentration of ZDDP (Zinc Dialkyl-Dithio-Phosphate) than permitted. The API standards have decreased the permitted amount of ZDDP in recent years (2004), which has been a problem with some cars.

Phosphorus (a component of ZDDP - Zinc Dialkyl-Dithio-Phosphate) is the key component for valve train protection in an engine and 1600ppm (parts per million) used to be the standard for phosphorus in engine oil. In 1996 the EPA forced that to be dropped to 800ppm and then more recently (2004?) to 400ppm - a quarter of the original spec. Valvetrains and their components are not especially cheap to replace and this drop in phosphorus content has been a problem for many engines (especially those with flat-tappet type cams). So why was the level dropped? Money. Next to lead, it's the second most destructive substance to shove through a catalytic converter. The US government mandated a 150,000 mile liftime on catalytic converters and the quickest way to do that was to drop phosphorous levels and bugger the valvetrain problem. Literally.
In the US, Mobil 1 originally came out with the 0W40 as a 'European Formula' as it was always above 1000 ppm. This initially got them out of the 1996 800ppm jam and knowledgeable consumers sought it out for obvious reasons. Their 15W50 has also maintained a very high level of phosphorus and all of the extended life Mobil synthetics now have at least 1000ppm. How do they get away with this? They're not classified as energy/fuel conserving oils and thus do not interfere with the precious government CAFE (corporate average fuel economy) ratings. (See my section on the EPA and fuel economy in the Fuel and Engine Bible for more info on this). This also means that they don't get the coveted ratings of other oils but they do protect your valvetrain. The same rule of thumb is true for racing oils like Royal Purple - because they're not classified as energy / fuel conserving, it would seem they still contain good quantities of ZDDP.
In fact, as a general rule-of-thumb, staying away from XX-30 oils and going to 10W-40 or higher might be the way to go if you have an older engine. 10W-40 and above is generally also not considered to be 'gas saving' and like the Mobil example above, doesn't mess with the CAFE rating.
If you live in England, Castrol market a product with ZDDP in the product description - 'Castrol Classic Oil With ZDDP Anti-Wear Additive' although it's not mainstream enough to be available everywhere. You'll have to find a specialist dealer. Castrol Classics. In the US, Rislone manufacture an oil supplement to boost the ZDDP content of your existing oil. Rislone Engine Oil Supplement.

Read more: http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_b...#ixzz1rou9uIqW

For the whole article, which is a very good read, try here: http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html

Now you know....

**EuroGraphite** · 12-04-2012 08:43 PM

Almost forgot...in my CU2 accord euro manual, it says:

Recommended Engine Oil
Oil is a major contributor to your engine's performance and longevity. Always use a premium-grade detergent oil. It is highly recommended that you use genuine Honda Motor OIl in your vehicle for as long as you own it.

Further it says:

Always use an API service SL or higher grade fuel-efficient oil. This oil is formulated to help your engine use less fuel.

Redline oil meets the requirements for API service SN, which is 2 grades higher than SL...

**BigBen** · 13-04-2012 10:03 PM

Higher content of Zinc over time will clog the cat converters and sometimes the oxygen sensors.

**AE092** · 13-04-2012 11:59 PM

lol just read the thread. Someone mentioned oil will go off; oil is hygroscopic it does not absorb water at all. It's brake fluid that does. Fair call that it doesn't hurt to upgrade to a better oil but calling OEM spec 5w30 FEO oil crap is just outright stupid. I've seen cars with near on 300k come in for services and exhibit excellent running order like the day it left the showroom. It's a reason why Honda specifies to use Honda Motor Oil whenever possible. For those thinking you'll get some sort of 'performance' gain; you'll definitely feel a placebo effect. I proved this point (with a Toyota) going from Semi-syn fluid to fully synthetic on the same dyno, the difference was 1wkw.

Forgot to mention I work for Honda Spare Parts.

**Fredoops** · 14-04-2012 12:33 AM

^

Originally Posted by AE092

lol just read the thread. Someone mentioned oil will go off; oil is hygroscopic it does not absorb water at all. It's brake fluid that does. Fair call that it doesn't hurt to upgrade to a better oil but calling OEM spec 5w30 FEO oil crap is just outright stupid. I've seen cars with near on 300k come in for services and exhibit excellent running order like the day it left the showroom. It's a reason why Honda specifies to use Honda Motor Oil whenever possible. For those thinking you'll get some sort of 'performance' gain; you'll definitely feel a placebo effect. I proved this point (with a Toyota) going from Semi-syn fluid to fully synthetic on the same dyno, the difference was 1wkw.

Forgot to mention I work for Honda Spare Parts.

^^ if Honda tells you to use FEO the why the hell are most dealers using castrol magnetec for?!

It's not water absorption, it's oxidation, it's the absorption of oxygen (which Dino based oils tend to do very readily). Making the oils much less stable.

I know for a fact our euros were not designed with the 5/10w-30 FEO in mind... Because Asia-pacific markets are the only markets who uses the Dino FEO as OEM fill, everywhere else (Honda EU and USA, recommands a synthetic fill on their user manuals, or the honda 2.2 dtec diesels DEMAND a full synthetic oil?)

Honda Australia tells you to use FEO to get your money...

Case in point: If Honda FEO is so great why did thy come up with FEO ultra (synethetic) themselves?!

If Honda FEO dino is so great why did Honda themselves specify they will be using a *Synthetic* oil (of xw-20 weight) for their future "Earthdreams" engines?

On www.bobistheoilguy.com there atr many oil test results and see for yourself the difference.

Ps: Honda FEO isn't "crap" outright.... It's just crap for the price y'all trying to charge for it. That's all. And with the 1wkw difference is actually quite impressive. That the same amount of power that the Hondata intake manifold heat gasket will give you. I'd say that a bloody good value performance mod.

**AE092** · 14-04-2012 12:30 PM

How you think oil will 'absorb' air through an air tight bottle is beyond me.

The fully synthetic option Honda brought out is/was for their performance based engines. Think FN2R/FD2R/DC5R/S2000 - The Accord Euro is not a 'performance' engine but feel free to make reference to guys putting them in EG/EK's.

You also like to take things out perspective, I didn't say FEO oil was great/good - I said its OEM spec oil thats designed to last and it's proven that. Would I run my OEM Toyota oil in my car? No, I track/circuit work alot so obviously I'd use a better oil.

1wkw 'gain' can be from anything; temperature/day/air density. Obviously you knew that.

**Fredoops** · 14-04-2012 01:33 PM

Originally Posted by AE092

How you think oil will 'absorb' air through an air tight bottle is beyond me.

Are.you.serious?!? Do you have any idea what happens to the oil chemical composition during use?!
That apart. A conventional oil have a 2 year shelf life, synthetic have a 5 year. So yes, shit happens even when it's in a sealed fukin bottle.

The fully synthetic option Honda brought out is/was for their performance based engines. Think FN2R/FD2R/DC5R/S2000 - The Accord Euro is not a 'performance' engine but feel free to make reference to guys putting them in EG/EK's.

Once again, are.you.serious?! You sell honda parts so obviously you know ALL the cars you mentioned apart from the s2k uses the K-series engine

The k24 used in the euro makes same power as th FN2R... While having significant more torque. So what's this non performance bs?! If Honda wants a non-performance engine they would've used the R-series SOHC like the south east Asian market accords.

Last time I checked the k24a had the same tolerance level as the k20a (of course they are, it's the same friggin design)

You also like to take things out perspective, I didn't say FEO oil was great/good - I said its OEM spec oil thats designed to last and it's proven that. Would I run my OEM Toyota oil in my car? No, I track/circuit work alot so obviously I'd use a better oil.

The FEO is designed for that stupid 6mth 10k km service schedule Honda Australia shove to owners. So no, it doesn't even have a decent drain interval.

1wkw 'gain' can be from anything; temperature/day/air density. Obviously you knew that.

Do you are saying your dyno comparison is invalid?

**AE092** · 14-04-2012 02:12 PM

Wow, you like getting angry don't you! Erm, yes I do know the S2000 use an F20C engine. Also you didn't mention oil during usage, the assumption was that it was kept in a bottle..

I pointed out I did a dyno comparison but you still didn't pick that there was environmental variances making the findings non-plausible. I even mentioned that in the above and you still couldn't pick it. That's ok, get angry cause I can finally use these!

LOL