Quiet Cat-Back Exhaust

[nedkerry]

Hi all,
I'm in the market for an after-market cat back exhaust for my FD1, but I can't seem to get a consistent response about what to buy. However, I am after something that offers a performance improvement (by way of throttle response or horsepower), and is also very quiet.

I had a chat to a Midas and Mr Muffler store (I'm not calling out the specific store), and got different pieces of general advice:
Midas
-Go press-bend since it's only a 4-cylinder 1.8L (I thought mandrel bend was always recommended?)
-Go custom built as it's hard to find a cat back exhaust in Australia, without having to import
-Go one size up (i.e., if the stock FD1 pipes are 1.78", then go to 2")
-Expect performance increases of 5-7% (is he hustling me?)
-Fit a larger exhaust to make it more quiet (wouldn't that negate the benefits of the larger pipes?)

Mr Muffler
-Go mandrel-bend
-Go custom built as it's hard to find a cat back exhaust in Australia, without having to import

Another store in the Eastern suburbs (keeping their anonymity)
-Go custom built
-Don't go beyond 2.25" or I might risk something something (I can't remember the term he used, but it would pose a threat to my car in the long run). (what does he mean?)

I started by looking at the Magnaflows, but it's hard to gauge from videos how noisy/un-noisy those exhausts are.

I guess I'd like to know what the next size up is from the stock cat-back exhaust, recommended systems that are quiet, recommended garages I can speak to.

I'm just horribly confused right now :S
Any advice would be really helpful!

Thanks.

[NeedVtec]

Twin loop muffler is the way to go. Even with an exhaust don't expect to feel much difference in performance.

[DreadAngel]

Where are you located?

[duzy]

Firstly whats your location and budget? We can suggest a few good exhaust shops.

IMO, I'd go for a custom 2" or 2.25" mandrel bent mild steel exhaust, hi flow cat, one or two resonators and a twin loop/oval muffler or something restrictive.
Performance wise wouldn't be much, but it'll feel slightly better in the high rpm range.

I'd suggest pairing the exhaust with a good air filter setup with cold air feed and those electronic throttle controllers for better response.

[Daveho1]

dis guy is on the money^^ i just finished up my exhaust for my b18 eg and i went with a 2.5" mandrel bent system with 2 resonators and a rear muffler and even that isnt too loud imho but it depends on mufflers aswell as if you bo for a chambered or triflow etc etc it will all effect the end result so its hard to make a hard and fast recommendation.

[nedkerry]

Where are you located?

South-East suburbs of Victoria

Firstly whats your location and budget? We can suggest a few good exhaust shops.

IMO, I'd go for a custom 2" or 2.25" mandrel bent mild steel exhaust, hi flow cat, one or two resonators and a twin loop/oval muffler or something restrictive.
Performance wise wouldn't be much, but it'll feel slightly better in the high rpm range.

I'd suggest pairing the exhaust with a good air filter setup with cold air feed and those electronic throttle controllers for better response.

Budget-wise, $600-$800. Midas mentioned a ballpark figure of $900 for a mandrel-bend. I thought that was a bit expensive considering there are reputable brands for two-thirds of the price.
Performance wise, which RPM range? I got told over the phone I'd notice the difference between the 3-4K range. I wasn't sure whether to believe him.
I'm reluctant on a cold air/short ram intake after watching the MightyCarMods video which demonstrated no benefits in performance. However, I do have a throttle controller, throttle body spacer, and pulley kit on the way.

dis guy is on the money^^ i just finished up my exhaust for my b18 eg and i went with a 2.5" mandrel bent system with 2 resonators and a rear muffler and even that isnt too loud imho but it depends on mufflers aswell as if you bo for a chambered or triflow etc etc it will all effect the end result so its hard to make a hard and fast recommendation.

Can you notice any throttle or horsepower improvements in the 3000-5000RPM range?
Where did you buy your system?

From what I can gather from all of your posts, would I be correct in saying that there's a trade-off between noise and performance, and it's not possible to have both?

[Honda_FD]

My exchaust setup is a Varex Muffler (Has a butterfly valve to control the volume)
with the mid resonator removed and a Short Ram intake system.
When the exhaust is fully opened car sounds AWESOME! Like an actual JDM K20 but without the loud vtec crossover.
Fully closed is slightly louder than stock.

Power wise. No real performance upgrade but with the exhaust opened you can feel that its a lot smoother throughout the revs

[Chernoby1]

From what I can gather from all of your posts, would I be correct in saying that there's a trade-off between noise and performance, and it's not possible to have both?

Not possible within your budget*

What you are trying to do is what Honda wants to do... just think about how much money they can spend on designing the thing. Every manufacturer wants to add as much power with the smallest amount of NVH for the mid size / non sports cars.
Their restriction is mainly the cost of manufacturing many exhasuts, so they wont use fancy materials; which as you are doing a one-off are able to do... but using fancy materials = more cost

If you are willing to go somewhat louder, but not tooo loud, thats where things get epxensive again. Working it out therotically is not too difficult, however a 10mm difference in pipe length can get a dramitic difference im loudness (if someone has bothered to do sound wave analysis within the exhaust), so it requires fabrication and then testing and then more fabrication. i would guess that 90% of companies that make exhasuts (especially the japanese folk) are focused on putting that effort into getting more power, not more quite andthat limits your options of doing it off the shelf massively.

Id estimate ~$2k to get it done to what you want and keep loudness to a minimum but getting you a nicer note and potentially some extra (~5%) power.

[nedkerry]

I just gave Dande Exhaust a buzz and they gave a more comprehensive picture. They mentioned it would be best to go with an extractor, first, and then the cat back system would compliment it. They mentioned ~5% increase wasn't out of the equation. One size up was recommended. Benefits recognised in the 3-5K RPM range.
The ballpark figures (without seeing the car) were:
Extractor $650
New Cat Converter $300
Cat Back Exhaust $600
Total: $1550

So...extractors...any recommendations for an FD1, while I do some more research on the side? :P

[curtis265]

extractor? FD1 doesn't have extractors - the head's just got one exhaust port which goes straight into the cat.

IMO go for a mild steel mandrel bent exhaust catback. keep the stock cat.

and then use a good resonator and put a good muffler on it - twinloop if you want it quiet or a varex if you want ti adjustable.

i cannot recommend the varex enough for it's ability to switch between stock quiet and fully sick mode

[nedkerry]

My exchaust setup is a Varex Muffler (Has a butterfly valve to control the volume)
with the mid resonator removed and a Short Ram intake system.
When the exhaust is fully opened car sounds AWESOME! Like an actual JDM K20 but without the loud vtec crossover.
Fully closed is slightly louder than stock.

Power wise. No real performance upgrade but with the exhaust opened you can feel that its a lot smoother throughout the revs

extractor? FD1 doesn't have extractors - the head's just got one exhaust port which goes straight into the cat.

IMO go for a mild steel mandrel bent exhaust catback. keep the stock cat.

and then use a good resonator and put a good muffler on it - twinloop if you want it quiet or a varex if you want ti adjustable.

i cannot recommend the varex enough for it's ability to switch between stock quiet and fully sick mode

ah that would explain why i couldn't find anything on fd1 extractors -__-

lol i love the last sentence.
Varex seems very very tempting, as it can be controlled. How much did it cost to get the whole setup (muffler, remote control etc)? I read in another thread and the remote broke down? Was it painful getting it replaced?
The only thing is, I'm not going for sound, though, and if there's no gain from it, it goes against my initial objective.

Ok, I think I've got a clearer picture in my head of what I want now:
The upgrade to a mild steel mandrel bend cat back exhaust + resonator is a definite. I'm expecting a gain there.

The last part is the muffler.
Is there going to be a significant difference between selecting lets say, the Varex remote controller muffler, versus a Magnaflow performance muffler, versus a local muffler recommended by Mr Muffler/Midas?

[curtis265]

the muffler and remote cost me 450 posted to me iirc. Comes with all the wiring you need.

There will be ab it of a gain in responsiveness if you get the right sized exhaust - 2.25 will do.

the varex is a straight through muffler when open (no muffling) and then chambered when shut. in other words, there's minimal restriction when it's open

my advice - try driving someone's car with an exhaust setup and see if you like the gains. i definitely noticed somethinig when i put a 2.25 on the h22.