whats wrong with FFcar on circuit?

**connorling** · 12-02-2008 12:16 AM

hi there, i was having a disscussion with my workmate about FFcar and FRcar, they keep saying that FF is useless in circuit, i mean why????

question1: what is the advantages and disadvantages of FF and FR
question2: which one is better on track?
question3: why FF has less traction over FR according to my workmates?
question4: what does it take to stop FFcar understeering when u heavily accelerate out of the corner?

question5: my workmate owes a RB25DET in the R32GTS, and also having a SR20DET 180SX, do u think my EGbreezeEG3 with b18cnonR can beat up the straight line???

question6: why honda is keeping DC and civic in FF??? if FF is no good on traction and understeering a lot.

thanks man
these questions have been in my head for a long time.

**d15z1SUX** · 12-02-2008 12:38 AM

hrm... well u don't totally step on it going out of a corner if you want to go fast this applies for both ff and fr in most cases.

fr drivers hate ff usually because it requires a differently driving style which they may not be accustomed to.

ff is not all doom and gloom just look at all the ff type r's and other ppls ff cars on this forum. try riding in someones ff that has some nice suspension mods. see how much it understeers. it probably won't understeer much unless they do something pretty severe.

yes ff isn't the best platform. well actually its the worst on paper lol but if its set up correctly who says its gonna stop you from having fun and getting some good lap times.

btw this has been discussed in at least 2 threads i swear. man the amount of arguing going on in those threads is like terrible. if you don't like ff dont drive one end of story lol.

**d15z1SUX** · 12-02-2008 12:43 AM

if you look up lap times for circuit racing you will probably find that some ff cars are beating fr and 4wd cars. factors such as power and driver skill could be taken into consideration though. but i think that proves that ff cars are not totally useless for circuit.

**e240** · 12-02-2008 07:44 AM

The Proconcept Civic all lap Wakefield under 1:09 and the Creek at 1:48
HiPower CRX - Wakefield - 1:07
A couple of us here have lapped Eastern creek around 1:55 in our FWD street cars

Alot of RWD drivers get pissed probably because their supposedly superior car gets shown up by a shopping trolley. LOL.

But yeah, i don't give a shit...I drive what I like, bugger all what people think.

**tinkerbell** · 12-02-2008 10:26 AM

Originally Posted by connorling

question1: what is the advantages and disadvantages of FF and FR

light weight = FF

question2: which one is better on track?

4WD

question3: why FF has less traction over FR according to my workmates?

tyre area is larger on RR (due to car being so heavy), but this does not mean there is more traction?

question4: what does it take to stop FFcar understeering when u heavily accelerate out of the corner?

the differential needs to work (and proper driver skills)

question5: my workmate owes a RB25DET in the R32GTS, and also having a SR20DET 180SX, do u think my EGbreezeEG3 with b18cnonR can beat up the straight line???

no.

question6: why honda is keeping DC and civic in FF??? if FF is no good on traction and understeering a lot.

FF = cheaper to manufacture

thanks man
these questions have been in my head for a long time.

simple modifications like rear sway bar upgrade remove understeer from FF (understeer is in-built by factory as understeer is SAFER on normal roads)

**Limbo** · 12-02-2008 12:07 PM

but main issues with tracking FF is tyre wear as you are putting to use the front alot more than a RWD would put to their rears. Thus traction starts to be an issue on longer tracks

**tinkerbell** · 12-02-2008 12:24 PM

you are talking about a different type of traction than the OP was asking about.

you are refering to longevity, not 'traction'

**90LAN** · 12-02-2008 12:27 PM

question5: my workmate owes a RB25DET in the R32GTS, and also having a SR20DET 180SX, do u think my EGbreezeEG3 with b18cnonR can beat up the straight line???

generally the other cars will be quicker
depends on your mods and theirs
but power to weight will have u in front with all having basic mods
IMO and my experience
turbo cars heat up easy on the track too
so after a couple of laps ...it will be another story

**aaronng** · 12-02-2008 12:55 PM

With FF, the front tyres both steer and apply power to the ground. So when you have larger slip angles while turning, the limit of traction during acceleration is lower than for an FR car. Of course, you can remedy this by using a high revving but low torque engine.

**connorling** · 12-02-2008 05:26 PM

Originally Posted by aaronng

With FF, the front tyres both steer and apply power to the ground. So when you have larger slip angles while turning, the limit of traction during acceleration is lower than for an FR car. Of course, you can remedy this by using a high revving but low torque engine.

so u meant b16a will be better than b18c in acceleration while turning???
since b16a has less torque than b18

**connorling** · 12-02-2008 05:32 PM

Originally Posted by tinkerbell

FF = cheaper to manufacture

but honda isnt selling cheap, the new CTR cost $40000, u can get a decent FR car for that price.

thing is i love honda, but i always hear people either laught at it being a FF or FF car why.

i think if civic is FR, then people will give more respect to it, i hate hearing people laught at honda.
perhaps honda can make base model FF, only typeR is FR, then wouldnt it be better??? but then again, less people will be able to do the convertions. or go for other FR cars

**aaronng** · 12-02-2008 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by connorling

so u meant b16a will be better than b18c in acceleration while turning???
since b16a has less torque than b18

Actually, I meant limit the torque so that you get less wheelspin when accelerating during a turn. You can do the same with a sensitive right foot, but it is not easy when you are committed 10/10 into a turn.