High SQ install

[RMA]

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And in respect to fuel, you think that people can actually notice the improvement in performance from just 2 points in octane? I seriously doubt it?

Well even my Jetta FSI Turbo can tell the difference as I am absolutely sure a Ferrari or say V8 Supercar can, I guess the point is that if your running around in a KIA you more than likely wont tell the difference.

I guess if your using a crud head unit then no matter which amp you use it will only make the crud louder not better.

Is it not the duty of the industry to guide people, give them understanding and raise the general standards ?

[Vinnie]

*sigh* the caa suppliers have arrived... yes it is the duty of the industry to inform people but those who sell a certain product clearly have a vested interest in pushing it.

back on topic, if i had not yet bought any of the components, before i did i would visit a couple of high end audio shops and get their opinions on what would be best for you. they wont be completely unbiased either but they should provide you with some more insight.

[PMG]

To Phil/RMA: I don't normally post on forums but it seems I was personally alluded to by you in a previous post here. I don't believe you know me or what I stand for, so please allow me a brief response:

First, from what I have seen on various local forums it seems that some of the more prolific posters are not actually offering some mystical knowledge on the pretext of 'helping the car audio industry to grow' but are in reality pushing their own brand or business barrows. And watch out if you don't agree or follow their rules.

I'm loathe to hark back to the mobile electronics industry's distant past, but fact is we not only respected other brands but also each other. That's what helped the local industry to grow in the nineties.

My technical/applications role with Alpine for many years was actually quite different to what some may think... part of our global responsibility was to challenge the engineering people with the performance of brands and products we felt were threats at the time.

During many, rigorous test and measurement sessions in Japan, we learned to respect the SQ skills of quite a few other companies. Most had best remain nameless, but I can tell you that Audison was on the list. With Alpine's tech resources it would be a mistake to assume that they couldn't or didn't better that level of performance in a heartbeat though... be careful.

To suggest that I am still pushing Alpine against all-comers is plainly absurd. Even during the IASCA days when I was working for them, no-one could ever have accused me of bias... in fact I got chewed out for being overly open to all brands, just as long as the install itself sounded good.

You have obviously never visited us either. Sure we stock Alpine because it represents good value, but we also stock and sell other premium brands. The new demo-room's not finished yet, but its A-B capability is already revealing - we just don't believe that SQ is in the brand but rather that it's in the listening. Come by Carlton (Sydney) sometime and hear for yourself.

Kind regards, PMG

[beayni85]

buy focal lol, nah best amps ive used are the japanese company u-dimension. focal use them in their show cars, i used it in my sq lancer. I touched alpine once, will never touch it again. Do you know how cheaply built there stuff is? the only stuff that isnt marked up a trillion percent is their f-1 series stuff. If your in melbourne i mite be able to hook you up with a lil bit above cost focal gear. mind you cost is still expensive, because being a well built company their parts are expensive and to still be able to compete in the market they lower there margins

[RMA]

Paul, all I was trying to point out was that specs on paper are there to help guide people in what a product does and is capable of, they should not be disregarded as some people seem to profess.
And no I don't subscribe to the theory a brand name equates instantly to the quality of a product.

May be the way I said things was a little bit of a cheap shot, for which I am sorry but seriously you make remarks like :

With Alpine's tech resources it would be a mistake to assume that they couldn't or didn't better that level of performance in a heartbeat though... be careful.

Well specs on the current range suggest that the heart has stopped.

Apline are not the center of all knowledge that is car audio and just because they are a big big company does not mean that they have some sort of super knowledge that gives them the edge over everyone else.

If size and dollars behind a company made the difference by your logic Pioneer makes a better turntable that Lynn, LG & Hyundai would be joint world leaders in just about everything and Altec Lansing would still be around - Me thinkest not !

But, hey feel free to believe what you like - its a free world.

[JaCe]

I feel slow for not knowing Altec Lansing isn't around anymore...

I really like their computer speakers- came with my Dell and was most impressed with them (c'mon, for Dell.. stock.. speakers!)

[PMG]

Hi again Phil (wow, two posts from me on a subject must be a record),

You keep assuming that I still defend Alpine as the ultimate in car audio - even after I took the trouble to explain my previous role there, my relative objectivity and even paid homage to the brand you market in Oz - Audison.

Over too many years in this industry I have listened to (sometimes under quite controlled conditions), used and installed many brands and products - initially for homes, studios and clubs/concerts but mostly for cars over the last 25 or so. We even got to compare some car stuff directly with extreme quality recording studio gear while making reference CDs and training videos.

I've also had the pleasure of visiting product manufacturing plants on several continents (not just Alpine, and admittedly not Elettromedia) and have spent time with some of the more acknowledged design/engineering gurus in the global audio and car sound business - again not just at Alpine.

While I respect your stance, it is simply a mistake to assume that larger companies (like Alpine who I knew well, but also several others whose people I've met and products I've heard) are not capable of performance and specs well beyond what may appear in their normal consumer range catalogues.

Unless you have seen some of their R&D resources, heard their prototypes and know some of their people, it is hard to imagine what they can achieve when market reality is not involved. But the cold hard facts are that most buyers, certainly in this country, are reluctant to pay for sonic performance and specs the average ear cannot hear, or quality they cannot see/touch.

My comment about Alpine (your italics) was simply to point this out... again, it is a mistake to assume that because sales/marketing may dictate what a product's packaging, performance and price must be to provide a realistic return in investment, that a brand's capability doesn't exist for a lot more.

A company's size has little to do with it's actual tech expertise - there are engineers at Alpine and I know at other larger companies doing stuff that would fry the average person's brain (like mine). Sadly, little of it sees the light of day, because they still have to keep the robots whirring and the payroll covered churning out gear that the vast majority of buyers want.

Which fortunately for you, me and others who still give a damn about extreme audio performance, leaves a door open for those small, lovingly hand-made brands from around the world too - some of which we use and install on a pretty regular basis here nowadays (yes, even over and above Alpine).

Altec Lansing huh? I ended up with a Voice of the Theatre system once, but don't recall any favourable impressions, although it was long ago. And by the way it's Linn - don't tell me you're a vinyl fan too? Kind regards, PMG

[RMA]

I feel slow for not knowing Altec Lansing isn't around anymore...

I really like their computer speakers- came with my Dell and was most impressed with them (c'mon, for Dell.. stock.. speakers!)

The car and home audio divisions were bought out by E.V. and then instantaniously closed down, we were sorry to see it go as we were very sucessful with it, the computer speakers are a licenced product not re A.L.

[RMA]

I hear where your coming from and agree in principal, perhaps one day you will be lucky enought to visit Elettromedia and see what they can and are doing.
Its certainly a far cry from the small opperation they ran in the mid 90's.
A certain Italian amp that you sell has had quite a lot of input from the head engineer and director of Elettromedia in its design as the two company directors are very close friends.

Yes my mistake on the spelling (but im one of those people who are rs at spelling for a whole different bunch of reasons), hey i'm ex Alberts in the 70's ex Harman International in the 80's and it goes on, and I dont give a rats what they say vinyl still sounds sweet with a good TT and MC three inch nail.
Ive heard KTel records on a great TT sound better than a Shefield on an average player.

BTW by George some new runners, this thread will have worn his little feet and shoes out by now.

Perhaps a beer next time Im in town?

Oh and Vinnie I never came in to start selling or pushing anything.

[ICACHA]

You seem to think I need new runners, maybe you should buy me some. I'm size 9 1/2 and yeah a beer sounds good, you buying?

[RMA]

The offer was for Paul, sorry.

[ICACHA]

at least you remember i dont drink, but how about the shoes you seem to think i need? maybe you should go into the shoe business also