Brakes feel wield!! after conversion

[Jackman]

noob so go easy on me

Ok just did a EG3 (breeze yes rear drums) conversion with DC2R brakes.
now when you press on the brake its how can i describe its low and squeesshy
using standard master brake cylinder and booster from the breeze.

Gonna put the dc2r master brake cylinder in soon and booster i guess

do you fink it will fix the problem or is there other thing i need to buy to make it 100 percent

your help is much appreciated

thanks in advance

[destrukshn]

bleed the brakes?
properly?

[Jackman]

the brake has been bleed already
thank you for your quick response

[bennjamin]

you are using the stock booster , master cylinder and stock proportioner.

Change them all to the DC2R spec and you should reinvent your firm pedal once more.

[Jackman]

if i just have dc2R booster and master cylinder would that do?
what does the proportioner do.
i have the dc2r booster and master cylinder already just need to install it
i didnt purchase the proportioner. how much are they usually?

[bennjamin]

because the breeze comes with rear drums the proportioner is different to the 4 wheel disc setups. Just get one off a EG5 or DC2 etc , install your brake booster/master cylinder and a fresh bleed and all should be fine

FYI ive driven in a ek with ek9 brakes , and the stock proportioner and it seemed to be all front brakes and no rear.(IE locked up the fronts very easy)

[Limbo]

Ben i'm assuming that what you've advised is only on the drum style ek?
Just that i did not change the prportioner either and mine feels fine.

ALso Jackman, you have to realise that since you stock booster is smaller it cannot push the caliper pot, which is bigger, without pushing down on the brake more, thus you need the MBC upgraded.

[JohnL]

the brake has been bleed already
thank you for your quick response

Maybe, but FWIW if I were you I'd do it again just to be sure before I spent any significant additional money. If you get some more bubbles it wouldn't be the first time that 'bled' brakes still had some air in the system.

Even if that fixes the soft pedal problem, you still might have to change other parts. If the pedal is too hard or soft then the booster may need changing. If the balance is wrong (i.e. easily locks up the fronts or the rears first) the MC may need changing (correct balance is probably more important than pedal hardness, unless the pedal is very hard).

A 'proportioner' is a valve fitted into the rear brake line that either sets a fixed limit to the max pressure that can be fed to the rear brakes, or, (I'm told) a more sophisticated valve can maintain a fixed relative pressure ratio front vs rear regardless of pedal force (more sophisticated, more expensive). The latter (relative line pressure ratio front / rear) is usually dictated by the different diameters of the front and rear pistons in the master cylinder, and / or by the relative diameters of the front vs rear caliper pistons.

Disc size also affects brake balance, smaller disc = less brake. Drum brakes tend to give stronger braking than discs, (which is why discs typically need a booster and drums typically don't). I'd be contacting Honda to ask them if the EG3 master cylinder, booster and proportioning valve are of similar spec to those from the DC2R units (most importantly, the diameters of the front and rear MC pistons, and the valve pressure limit). If they aren't then you'll need to change to the DC2R units.

Brake balance should be tested on wet and dry surfaces, because the front brakes will tend to lock up more easily in the wet due to less forward weight transfer than in the dry (at max braking). If you have perfect brake balance in the dry, you'll lock up the fronts in the wet very easily, but if you have perfect balance in the wet the rears will lock up easily on a dry road.

Since it's easier to lose traction in the wet it's probably better to bias slightly to the rear, not that you'll be able to fine tune the balance with standard components (for that you'll need a brake bias bar or an adjustable proportioning valve), just that you should check that the brakes don't lock up way too easily on a wet road, keeping in mind that dry braking is also important (i.e find a good compromise).

[Benson]

You will definately need to upgrade to a dc2r 1inch MC and Booster. AS for proportional valve not needed but good to change.

[Jackman]

thanks guy for the quick response
does the dc2R proportioning valve have different spec to those off a normal eg or dc2.
is it hard to replace this or is it messy where all the brake fluid goes everywhere ahahah

[Samo]

i dont think the porportional valve for a car with ABS is the the same as NON-ABS cars ..

u need one out of a eg5 vti or si

[Jackman]

i found a value from a DA9 do you guys fink it will do or do i have to get specific DC2 or EG's?
thanks guys