sedan vs hatchback

[[[d a n n y]]]

Pffft

Sedan OWNS hatch around corners

Wyn did that make u feel better?
id rather a hatch anyday over a sedan. but itf it's a coupe..

hm...

[pizza_boy]

Want to revive an old topic, as planning to start a small project for city runaround car. Couldn't find any other thread comparing the 2 EG models.

I used to own 91 Breeze, which awesome, until i had a head to head accident I delivered pizza, done heaps of interstate moves in this car, and almost never had a problem. But I never had a go in EG sedan...

From this topic I understand follwoing:

Points to EG Hatch in terms of prformance are following:
1. It's a bit lighter than a sedan.
2. Better in low speed cornering

Points to EG Hatch are following:

1. More stable on high speeds + high speed cornering

In terms of other things:

1. Sedan has 4 doors + more boot space + If you got a baby sedan is better
2. Sound system in hatch would probably sound better. (Physics wyse)
3. You can move quite a big fridge in a hatch, or other big items (personal experience)
4. Parking is easier in the Hatch.
5. More ppl like hatch -> Hatch is easier to sell afterwards.


Are all my points correct? sure they are not

Please share the experience

What bout parts, are they easier to get for hatch or sedan?

thanks.

[RtN]

Got 2 ideas:

1. Coupe
2. Coupe

[pizza_boy]

Got 2 ideas:

1. Coupe
2. Coupe

I drove a VTi coupe once, didn't like it at all, felt much higher and uncomfy than a hatch... but it's wasn't in good condition at all, maybe that's why...
but anyway, topic is "sedan vs hatchback"

p.s. can u provide any numbers, facts why coupe is better though?

e.g. If we will trust redbook,

1996 Honda Civic Vti - Coupe
Kerb Weight (kg) 1029; Wheel Base (mm) 2620; Length (mm) 4450 ;Width (mm) 1695 Height (mm) 1375;

1995 Honda Civic VTi – Sedan
Kerb Weight (kg) 1062; Wheel Base (mm) 2570; Length (mm) 4450; Width (mm) 1695; Height (mm) 1390

1995 Honda Civic VTi – Hatch
Kerb Weight (kg) 1025; Wheel Base (mm) 2570; Length (mm) 4070; Width (mm) 1695; Height (mm) 1345

So coupe has longest Wheel base, lengh of coupe and sedan are the same. Height is best for Hatch.

So what bout aerodynamics? Is than Hatch body will be the best to use with da spoiler on the back?

[RtN]

well hmm just lower =] is that you p1zzaboy from CS? LOL

[JohnL]

This isn't to do specifically with a direct comparison between EG hatch and sedan, but:

All else being equal, sedan bodies are inherantly stiffer in torsion than hatch bodies (and a chassis can never be too rigid, but easily can be too floppy). This is because the hatch door aperture does nothing at all to stiffen the rear end of the chassis, in fact the opposite is the case. Think of a cardboard box with all sides enclosed, it's pretty stiff in torsion. Now cut one end panel out, it becomes very floppy in torsion. This is a close analogy for a hatch body.

The hatch door does nothing (significant) to 'close the box' because the latch just isn't stiff enough and doesn't hold the hatch door tightly in any case. In my mates EG, if I look backwards I can easily see the hatch door moving laterally relative to the chassis as the car passes over bumps and undulations (this is with a stock suspension, it would probably be even worse with stiffer springs / dampers etc).

On the other hand, sedans have a bonded in rear window that adds a lot of stiffness (half closing the end of the 'box'). However, they typically (these days) also have an aperture between the boot and passenger compartment (for carrying long loads) that is like having the other half of the end 'box panel' open, so even most sedans could easily be more rigid. At least the rear screen is there significantly stiffening the structure, but not the case with hatch bodies.

A hatch body will benefit from at the very least adding a good rear tower brace, but even better would be some style of 'X' brace to 'close the box'. My Accord (CB7) handles very noticably better with a rear tower brace and an X brace (fitted directly behind the rear seat back), and I can only assume that a hatch would benefit even more...

[JohnL]

So what bout aerodynamics? Is than Hatch body will be the best to use with da spoiler on the back?

Hatches are notoriusly bad aerodynamically compared to sedans, all else being equal of course...

Due to the abruptly truncated rear body, the laminar flow seperates in a big way as soon as the airflow reaches the end of the car, and creates a lot of turbulence behind the car. Sedans allow the flow to pass more gently downward over the rear window onto the boot lid, then the flow seperates at the boot lip. The perfect aerodynamic shape for reduced drag is a 'teardrop' shape (blunt end forward), and sedan bodies more closely resemble this than do hatch bodies.

With good airflow over the car body, the area of drag inducing turbulence behind it tends to be about as large as the area at the extreme rear end of the car, which is much smaller with a sedan than a hatch. Of course there are exceptions, like those hideous notch back Volvos, which have loss of laminar flow at the roof lip and at the boot lip.

My understanding is that rear lips don't do much if anything to reduce drag, but if properly designed do slightly reduce rear lift, but most are just bling...

[sir_egg]

IMO the weight ratio of a hatch benefits over a sedan.. looks wise they both have gr8 looks once modify but hatch screams for more attention lmaO! as for cornering n stability hatch tends to enter n exit corners more quicker whereas sedans keeps a balance of all 4 wheels but overall hatchie ftw!!

[pizza_boy]

...

Thanks for the writeup Aerodynamics and mechanics are great things, was thinking to go for sedan anyway, to compare them myself by personal exp., now even more keen.

Reminds me a car we have in ex Soviet Union, kinda 2dr coupe, called Lada model 2108, there is couple around in AU, ugly as, anyway, if you jack it up on a side, you almost can't open any doors/boot, as it's body so weak that it twists

p.s. So same story goes to Coupe as with hatch? unless it has body stiffness improved? probs better find engineering drawings and compare...

[pizza_boy]

well hmm just lower =] is that you p1zzaboy from CS? LOL

na mate... but i had to buy CS recently, after 'driving' to work around North Ryde

[d15z1SUX]

do u need 4 doors or can u live with have 3 doors?
which look do u prefer?
hatch is a bit more boy racer
hatch has more exterior parts available also easier to find a bolt on exhaust
think that is about all...

[MRB18R]

I think EG's have that JDM look about them compared to the EH sedan which is more of a family car, even tho there is a 20 - 30 KG difference its alot of weight off the hatchback which therefore should make the EG abit more quicker, not much but it does help...