NEW 2009 Euro Luxury Auto Pinging

[yfin]

The time to fix is the main issue here. Surely Honda engineers in Japan have the capability to resolve and test a mechanical fix in a short timeframe. 7+ months is not good enough and points to someone in Honda slowing down the fix process or not taking this seriously

[boleh]

yes 7 months show something is really not quite right.. what if this while thing isnt that simple.. maybe the k24z3 isn't worth the 148kw / 8.9l.100km as already advertised? and the solution they've got would need that figure revised to something like 140kw, and they can't release it because they can't do it

i m talking sh** on friday

[denot]

7 month? I know they just recall Civic 2001 7th gen last year to fix a problem with their headlight stuff that has been raised when the car just released...

[buddah51au]

You mention a time frame of 7 months, but what you fail to take into account is the time frame it takes to realise there is a problem to start with.

I would look at it as a 3 to 4 month time frame to realise that they have a problem that is effecting a high percentage of cars. From there they would need to carry out field tests to evaluate the problem & then develop a solution. After that they would carry out further extensive field tests to make certain they have found a solution & that would rarely be achieved on the first attempt. It can be very time consuming & people need to be patient. Is it not enough to know that Honda Japan are and have been working towards a satisfactory solution to this problem. Rest assured they will do whatever it takes to eliminate the problem & will release the outcome when they are completely satisfied they are happy with the outcome.

Lets compare apples with oranges, we are talking about a car with a base price of around $35K & people are complaining that a fix for a particular problem has not been found within the first year of a model run.

Now as irrelevant as it is, lets compare that with the mega rich folks who buy multi million $ ocean going yachts who always say it takes around 2 years to get the bugs ironed out. You don't see them complaining about it, instead they let the engineers work through the systems until everything is as it should be. So if any of you guys win lotto and strike it rich, stay away from yachts.

[HunterZero]

What is a worry is that I've heard of Acura dealers in the USA telling customers that the pinging noise is 'normal', but they still pass the complaints on the Honda/Acura. I guess most CU2 Accords have this problem then...

I'm hoping we don't start to see posts of owners of this car over time with engine damage.

Pinging issue for me would be a deal breaker with this car... It's a shame, since they got the driveline in the CL9 so right...

- HZ

[nebt]

Y
I would look at it as a 3 to 4 month time frame to realise that they have a problem that is effecting a high percentage of cars. From there they would need to carry out field tests to evaluate the problem & then develop a solution. After that they would carry out further extensive field tests to make certain they have found a solution & that would rarely be achieved on the first attempt. It can be very time consuming & people need to be patient. Is it not enough to know that Honda Japan are and have been working towards a satisfactory solution to this problem.

Buddah is right. The processes evolved etc aren't as simple as jumping into the problem and having a fix instantly. As frustrating as it is for you guys waiting for a fix...it's just as frustrating for the engineers working on finding the problem to producing the most viable solution to the problem. It's very frustrating but just have to be patient.

I guess most CU2 Accords have this problem then...

I wouldn't go as far as saying "most CU2 Accords" having this problem. It just seems like a lot of CU2 owners have this problem because of the various honda fanclub forums having a thread with CU2 owners complaining about the problem.

[09euro23]

yes 7 months show something is really not quite right.. what if this while thing isnt that simple.. maybe the k24z3 isn't worth the 148kw / 8.9l.100km as already advertised? and the solution they've got would need that figure revised to something like 140kw, and they can't release it because they can't do it

i m talking sh** on friday

boleh - i dont think you are talking shit - I was actually thinking about this very issue last night - i said to my wife that maybe Honda has advanced the timing too far to achieve the 148Kw power figure, and hence caused a 'pinging' issue... Therefore, any retarding of the timing (in order to fix the ping) will sacrifice some degree of power (this is from experience with some of my previous V8 engines).

I am going to keep a very close eye on the fix and concentrate on this power issue - cause i will be pissed if they have to revise power figures down after just spending over $50k... As far as i am concerned, they need to keep the power at 148Kw, or take back the car due to false sales. Maybe this is why they are taking so long to fix....? could be some serious legal issues if power has to be sacrificed!

[denot]

So the lesson for ppl who wants to buy CU2 is to include "110% money back quarantee if pinging (or whatever honda said this problem was) occured on the car" and if the dealer doesnt want to approve it, walk away...

[bk212]

I don't believe it is a serious problem at all and I am sure it will be resolved. Sure i can understand how some people would be frustrated & annoyed with it, but taking a backward step to a mazda to me is laughable. They have their share of problems as well. If the Mazda 6 had a pinging problem you probably couldn't hear it over the road noise that enters the cabin.

When i was working in the trade it was common to see people with problems wanting them fixed yesterday. I look at it from a different perspective, if a manufacturer has a problem with a vehicle I prefer to see them take their time & resolve the problem properly & permanently, which I am certain will be the outcome in this case.

As for Denot wanting a sound clip, I believe that would be an impossibility as it is not loud enough for a microphone to pick up.

Mate I see where you are coming from. I certainly prefer just about everything about the Euro to the Mazda 6 - but I can't tell you how annoying this noise is. It takes away all the enjoyment of driving a car. And in a Honda too - they are meant to purr! I think I'm so p*d off because I feel like this has taken away the enjoyment of owning a new car. I understand it will be fixed etc but my car won't be new anymore. Anyway, you're right I guess it's all been said before and we just need to wait for a solution.

[Joystick]

Hmmm can anyone post the sound of this "pinging"? A friend and I would really appreciate if we can hear what does it sound like so we can be aware of it...

Or, perhaps someone already trade in their CU2 to dealer becoz of this? I might pop in to the dealer and run a test drive to check how does the pinging sound.

I tried capturing the 'pinging' sound on video but no luck. I can put up the vids if you would like though.

Also, I think many on here including myself are generally happy with the car but just venting about the whole pinging issues. It does detract from the whole experience but meh, they'll fix it.

[SPQR]

boleh - i dont think you are talking shit - I was actually thinking about this very issue last night - i said to my wife that maybe Honda has advanced the timing too far to achieve the 148Kw power figure, and hence caused a 'pinging' issue... Therefore, any retarding of the timing (in order to fix the ping) will sacrifice some degree of power (this is from experience with some of my previous V8 engines).

I am going to keep a very close eye on the fix and concentrate on this power issue - cause i will be pissed if they have to revise power figures down after just spending over $50k... As far as i am concerned, they need to keep the power at 148Kw, or take back the car due to false sales. Maybe this is why they are taking so long to fix....? could be some serious legal issues if power has to be sacrificed!

Honda says it's a post combustion sound so it is pinging. It's more likely to be caused by the higher compression ratio of the CU2's engine (compared with the CL9) and that's probably why the "fix" is taking so long: Reducing the compression ratio is not a feasible option for Honda as this would require opening up the engine of all affected cars all over the world where consumers have clout. Hence the solution would have to encompass software (possibly detuning) and a small component like a more sensitive/reactive knock sensor.

They will try to avoid the legal issues but that's a matter of financial might: No consumer could reasonably alone take on the legal resources available to Honda and then convince a judge that there has been a reduction in power or that it means anything important is another matter altogether.

[buddah51au]

Pinging is a pre combustion sound, not a post combustion sound....sure they may sound similar, but they are 2 different things. Pre ignition caused by high compression or ign timing too far advanced usually leaves a tell tale sign on the spark plugs.

After almost 2000km of having this problem I removed the spark plugs yesterday to check for any tell tale signs and they are burning completely clean with no sign of pre ignition.

This satisfies my mind that it is a post combustion sound a stated by Honda.