[CU2] Excessive oil consumption

[bugeater]

I've spoken to the dealership and Honda Australia.

Honda Australia were a complete joke. They just denied any argument I made and stated repeatedly that it is "within specification". Wouldn't tell me where it would have to be to be outside specification (trade secret). When I mentioned that few other Euro owners have this problem (and those that do complain) this was basically dismissed as being meaningless.

So essentially you make a complaint and to respond to the complaint they just repeat what you are complaining about and say it is fine.

I also pointed out that consumer law isn't about what the manufacturer deems to be okay, but what would affect the purchasing decision of said consumer. I know I wouldn't have bought the car had I known about this.

Also, apparently within specification means the car is fine. Not just fine within the warranty period (which it probably is). So I asked if they would extend the warranty for me, since the car is apparently fine and therefore this wouldn't cost them anything. They refused.

Even my concern that commuting in the car will increase oil consumption was met with basic derision. My driving is pretty tame at the moment (a lot of freeway and highway driving), but this is likely to change just outside the warranty period.

Oh and the funniest was that the low oil pressure light is apparently a "drive somewhere to top up the oil" light. And not "oh shit my engine will die if I don't stop right now" light.

Oh and the Acura TSX isn't at all comparable because it is built with different specifications in the US (not sure how true this is).

[curtis265]

why would you drive differently within and after the warranty period?

[bugeater]

why would you drive differently within and after the warranty period?

Life circumstances change. We use PT at the moment, but intend to move house into suburbia and then the car will be used as a commuter. I'd expect stop-start traffic would consume more oil (and petrol) than the current highway/freeway driving it mostly does.

[dougie_504]

High-load driving will use more oil. Stop-start will use more petrol.

My honest advice would be to do things the other way around. Beat the living crap out of the engine so the oil consumption gets worse and goes above the 'acceptable limit' for oil use. Only baby it when it's cold and you're outside warranty. Will cost you more in petrol but whatever you'll live

For now, I'd personally try to run it into the ground and get a new engine/rebuild while it's under that warranty.


Unfortunately this is just proof that warranties are usually only worth the paper they're written on.

[stndrd]

You will find that this has ALOT to do with the fact that Honda are now using 0W20 engine oil, instead of a 5W30 due to emissions regulations. Get rid of the 0W20, use some Penrite HPR5 5W40 and watch that consumption plumet to next to nothing

[bugeater]

Actually, it is using FEO 10W30 according to the dealer.

As to conditions that cause the oil consumption to rise, its been hard to find much of a correlation, but it was very variable over the test, from about 0.3L/1000 km to 1L/1000km. About the only thing that seemed correlated was the amount of stop start driving i.e. more oil consumption with more stop-start/suburbia driving. That said, correlation does not imply causation

[Luppifs]

Folks,

I’ve just had the engine replaced by Honda in my 2012 Manual Lux Euro. (is this a first for any Australian Euro ??)

In short, my engine was a lemon from the moment is was manufactured.

To provide some history to this, my car had to be towed in March 2013 at 4,600km due to insufficient oil in the engine.
(yes, a very sad day for my 5 month old $40,000 vehicle)

The oil consumption tests then commenced. It soon became apparent the oil consumption was getting worse. The exhaust tips were full of thick carbon residue.

I would check the oil level myself and noticed the oil was as black as tar on the dipstick. Not only did it look burnt, it actually smelt burnt.

When the car had 7300km on the odo, i brought it in for its routine 1000km check.
It required 1.3 litres of oil to bring it back to level.

Given the severity of the oil consumption, i was expecting Honda Australia at this point to begin some form of remediation, but they wanted me to continue for another 1000km of driving. <insert expletives here>

So it was topped it up with oil, but the car only survived 600km of driving after this.
My all-time favourite warning light appeared (the Oil Pressure light) due to lack of oil.

The vehicle was then towed back to the Service Dept, where it sat on a hoist for 5 weeks in total. Lets just say they didn't bother to even measure how much oil it had gone through, as this event marked the official end to their consumption tests.

The first 2 weeks were spent disassembling the engine. Initially they were planning on only replacing the piston rings and valve stems, however they continued to disassemble the engine to discover the cylinder walls were ‘scored’ (ie… scratched)

A replacement engine known as a “Short Block” was then ordered and installed, which is basically the bottom section of the engine block containing the pistons etc.
The existing engine head was sent away to a 3rd party head specialist, who refit the engine stem seals using a micrometer and other fancy tools.

I only just picked up the car last week from the Service dept, so i can't comment on whether it has corrected the issue, but i would assume the manufacture issue has since been sorted out in the Honda factory. Fingers crossed...

The cause of all the oil burning was discovered to be faulty Oil Control Rings, which I had confirmation were not installed correctly at the time of manufacture in the factory. The wrong amount of torque was applied, which caused them to spin around, when they aren't supposed to. These were also were responsible for damaging the cylinder walls.

I believe what we have here is a simply a bad batch of motors. The vehicles that appear to be affected are a small set of 2012 Manual Euros.

Including my Euro, I'm aware of 3 other people with vehicles exhibiting this issue, and they are all recent (2012) manuals. (one of them is in Canberra and isn't an OzHonda member, but i tracked them down and have personally spoken to them to confirm their model/year details). Ah, the wonders of the internet

Prior to this vehicle, i owned a 2007 Euro (CL9 Manual Lux) from new, which i drove for 78,000km, which didn't consume a single drop of oil during its 5 years of me owing it.

For those interested, there are threads on TSX forums about their 2012 manuals having the exact same issues as us (our Euro is known in the states as the "Acura TSX").

Anyways, i hope this info helps some owners who may be going through the same thing...

[curtis265]

thanks for the story

good to see things for fixed.

[Jasemas]

Jesus your engine died
And they didn't replace the 'whole' thing
just the block? how ****ing cheap are they...
At least it got sorted
So moral of the story... you need to go back to Honda and explain to them about the oil control rings in the pistons

[curtis265]

Jesus your engine died
And they didn't replace the 'whole' thing
just the block? how ****ing cheap are they...
At least it got sorted
So moral of the story... you need to go back to Honda and explain to them about the oil control rings in the pistons

that's not even cheap

considering the labour they'd have to use putting the motor back together..

[Fredoops]

So the threashold is 1litre plus?????

Some tolerance level

[stndrd]

A new complete short block from Honda will be around the $3.5-$5k mark. Add in their labour at $100+ p/h and it is not cheap at all to them