Euro Front Brake Disc Warping Issue

[olda]

The strange thing is that I have been much more agressive with previous cars, both manual and auto and this is the first time ever that I have had any rotor problems. This is the first time I have ever got more that 30K out of a set of tyres so I'm not to heavy with the Euro. At this rate I should be getting over 40K from them. I must be getting old I had a 5.7l Berlina as a company car and replaced the first set of tyres at 17K. They weren't happy with me but hey it was my first V8 and I went a but nuts not to mention the stock tyres were crap and totally unsuitable for the power of a V8. So many people having this problem can not be put down to driving habbits alone.

Warping of brake rotors as described by several of you guys on this thread, is not normal.
It looks very much like an engineering design issue and should be addressed by HMCA ASAP.
People affected should write a formal letter of complaint to HMCA.
My 2 cents worth...............

[fraqqie]

I just wanted to clarify this... when the steering wheel shakes when you step on the brakes, it basically its starts changing directions sporadically am i right?

it tahts so... might have to say hello to Mr Honda sometime soon >.<

[Hoffy]

I just wanted to clarify this... when the steering wheel shakes when you step on the brakes, it basically its starts changing directions sporadically am i right?

it tahts so... might have to say hello to Mr Honda sometime soon >.<

The steering wheel shakes from side to side a few milimetres, similar to if your front wheels are out of balance at high speed except on when braking. It does not cause the steering wheel to turn and the car to move, although the shaking in my case made corning at speed with the foot on the brake a bit freeky. It seems that also the front wheels are shaking and affecting the handling in the corner.

[fraqqie]

i get ya

when i stop at the lights, the steering wheel would turn and i would have to put a fair bit of counterin force so it'll stop in a straight line rather than next to someone else's car

i have no idea whats happening though... i'll be doing a front brake change soon

hope that'll take care of it

[panda[cRx]]

I've had a problem with my disc rotors from before 20k mark where the steering wheel shaked when applying the brakes lightly at speeds above 40km/h. The rotors were machined at 20k service but it had returned by 30K. The strange thing was that it got worse when the discs were hot and in hot weather like last weekend in Sydney. I finally got sick of it when trying to go around a corner a bit fast and the shaking affected the stability in the corner. I nearly shit myself as there was a concrete barrier on the outside of the corner. Took it back to the dealer today and just found out the they are going to replace the rotors and pads under warranty . Not bad seeing that the pads probably needed replacing anyhow .

Not sure if anyone else has experienced this problem. If you do, push for it to be fixed under warranty.

i didn't read anything but the first post but brake shudder with the euro's is a semi-common problem, honda knows it too (same with vti accords too)

should be no problem under warranty to replace the pads and machine the discs for you


(i didn't say that lol )

[aaronng]

I think the shudder/vibration through the brake pedal comes from deposits on the rotors. After a hard stop at the traffic lights, you'll get super hot rotors. And what does one do at the lights? Sit with their foot on the brake! Since our pads are now non-asbestos and also non-carbon metallic (for race pads only), we get the stuff slightly softening and transferring onto the rotor!

Then, to fix it we all get our rotors machined and then the warping happens. One bad thing about machining the discs on the TSX (and hence Euro) is that they warp very easily and quickly after that.

I think that the initial problem is not rotor warpage, but after getting it machined, it really does end up warping. For those with shuddering through the brake pedal and have NOT machined their rotors, try doing a semi-hard stop from 80km/h to clear up the deposits. Remember, after stopping, take your foor off the brake pedal! Drive around to cool the rotors down and see if your shuddering is gone.

[panda[cRx]]

I think that the initial problem is not rotor warpage, but after getting it machined, it really does end up warping. For those with shuddering through the brake pedal and have NOT machined their rotors, try doing a semi-hard stop from 80km/h to clear up the deposits. Remember, after stopping, take your foor off the brake pedal! Drive around to cool the rotors down and see if your shuddering is gone.

well aaron it's a fairly common problem like i said. i'm pretty sure if you asked any honda service dept they would confirm this.

i was actually talking to our foreman at work about this (#1 honda tech in aus)
and he said that the pads retained too much heat thus causing the discs to warp.
so after the machining and the new pads it's all fine.

occaisionally some customers get a shudder for a couple of days but it's just the pads/discs settling in and it goes after 2-3 days

[Eurotony]

Hi Guys

Has anyone ele had any issue's with the front Disc's warping. My MY 04 lux auto has had the front disc's & pads replaced at 40k & now at 82k I have the same issue.
Is this a problem with the Euro or is it my driving style? The only thing that I can think off that may cause a heat sink issue is that when you pull up at lights, you tend to leave your foot on the brakes all the time in an auto to stop creeping forward. I'm wondering if that may have something to do with it. I certainly don't drive the car hard though, so I'm thinking it's the car & not me.
Would really like to hear what others have experienced. I know it has been mentioned before, but I can't find a specific thread in the search function. I'm having the car serviced tomorrow morning & have asked the dealer to fix it then.
Cheers
Eurotony

[BiLL|z0r]

I'm now getting the same thing at 26K. I searched and found this thread:
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38787

It's only minor atm + I need a wheel rebalance anyway. At my 30K service I'll have them machine the discs to start with and take it from there.

[yfin]

Posted by JEFF on Temple of Vtec in response to a warping on TSX question

Source: http://www.vtec.net/forums/one-messa...sage_id=381567

...

I can almost guarantee it's just the (OEM) brake pads. My TSX is driven fairly lightly (about 7500miles/year) and it did the same thing. The brakes felt okay (key word) most of the time, but if I was on the freeway and got into them moderately from a decent speed (say, 80mph) there was quite a bit of a wobble felt through the steering wheel (it was also somewhat audible). I recently replaced the pads with some Axxis Ultimates and immediately there was a huge improvement.

Basically what's happening is that the OEM pads have some compound that leaves some deposits on the rotors. And if you don't drive your car frequently, the pads even seem to harden or glaze somewhat and your braking power diminishes over time and the likelihood of experiencing the "wobble" seems to increas greatly.

When we first installed the Axxis ultimate pads, I immediately sensed that they pads were much better suited to the sporty nature of the TSX than the stock pads. Stopping power is immensely improved over the "hardened" stock pads that were on my car. It's far better than even fresh stock pads. Additionally, these pads "bite" hard into the rotors, to the point that they pretty much cleaned off all the deposits that the stock pads left on the rotors and there was an immediately noticeably improvement in the "brake wobble" problem. With more miles on the pads, they seem to have worn completely through whatever deposits were on the rotors, so there's absolutely no trace of any brake wobble now. I was thinking of getting new rotors and installing them when I changed the pads, but now I'm glad I didn't.

So while many people would automatically assume that the rotors are warped when they feel like mine did, I can tell you that it very likely isn't the case, and all you need are some more aggressive pads.

There are two downsides to the pads. And one of them is an extremely minor one. The most noticeable drawback is that they dust quite a bit more than stock. If you want the finish on your wheels to remain in good shape, you WILL have to clean the dust off more frequently. At least twice as frequently as normal. And the 2nd issue is so minor I almost hesitate to mention it, but I have noticed a very minor squeal at low speeds, but it's so infrequent and mild you may not notice it. I really only started noticing it once when I was pulling up to a drive-thru teller at the bank with the window down. Since then I've listened more closely and it doesn't always happen and with the windows up you will rarely notice it. But in my opinion, the benefits of these pads far outweigh these slight drawbacks. There is so much more braking power available (hopefully you have some tires that can take advantage of the added braking capacity) and there is no wobble (or rotor "warp") whatsoever!

***

Also see this article by Temple of VTEC http://www.vtec.net/articles/view-ar...&page_number=4

It's Time to Rethink the Brake Pads
One item that has escaped Acura's attention is the TSX's brakes. We're going to be brutally honest: the stock brake pads are pretty bad. The feel is okay, but they provide somewhat weak stopping power and are prone to overheating easily (particularly when slowing from freeway speeds). When they overheat, they tend to leave deposits on the rotors, which can lead to a very noticeable and irritating brake shudder. Many people misdiagnose this problem as rotor warpage, but as we proved on our own car, it's really the stock pads chubbing the rotors. It only took a few thousand miles for this problem to appear on our TSX project car, and these were very gentle miles. While the symptoms felt almost exactly like rotor warpage, we decided to swap out the stock pads for some more aggressive aftermarket pads, and the results were simply astounding. Without any rotor resurfacing, the brake shudder and wobble disappeared almost immediately, and within a few days of normal driving, all of the OEM pad deposits were wiped clean from the rotors. To this day, there has been absolutely no brake shudder and brake fade is a thing of the past. Even more impressively, the car has benefitted from a tremendous improvement in braking power. The only downside to this pad upgrade is that the new pads will squeak in very rare circumstances and they generate appreciably more brake dust than the stock pads. Otherwise they are one of the biggest "bang for the buck" modifications out there for the TSX and we highly recommend it. We installed Axxis Ultimates on our TSX, but similar results are likely with any number of other aftermarket fitments.

[aaronng]

Is this a problem with the Euro or is it my driving style? The only thing that I can think off that may cause a heat sink issue is that when you pull up at lights, you tend to leave your foot on the brakes all the time in an auto to stop creeping forward. I'm wondering if that may have something to do with it. I certainly don't drive the car hard though, so I'm thinking it's the car & not me.

If you brake from 80 to 0, and then at the stop lights leave it in D, then you would have to hold the brakes down to stop the car from moving. Hot discs/pads + pressure = deposits. Euro's pads easily leaves deposits like yfin posted. Try my hard braking from 100 to 20, and then drive around to cool down without using brakes. It should fix the shudder.

[Eurotony]

Hi Guys

Has anyone ele had any issue's with the front Disc's warping. My MY 04 lux auto has had the front disc's & pads replaced at 40k & now at 82k I have the same issue.
Is this a problem with the Euro or is it my driving style? The only thing that I can think off that may cause a heat sink issue is that when you pull up at lights, you tend to leave your foot on the brakes all the time in an auto to stop creeping forward. I'm wondering if that may have something to do with it. I certainly don't drive the car hard though, so I'm thinking it's the car & not me.
Would really like to hear what others have experienced. I know it has been mentioned before, but I can't find a specific thread in the search function. I'm having the car serviced tomorrow morning & have asked the dealer to fix it then.
Cheers
Eurotony

Update
Picked up the car from the dealer this afternoon after the 80k service. Brand new disc rotors & pads replaced under warranty. No questions asked. They acknowledge that it is a known problem with the Euro, but as far as they know my car is the first car to come back with a repeat dose.
Southside Honda