[Euro] Hondata Update

[aaronng]

if it costs more than AU$2200, Vi-PEC wins

On a Honda, the VI-PEC seems like an Emanage Ultimate on drugs.

[Chris_F]

On a Honda, the VI-PEC seems like an Emanage Ultimate on drugs.

No way, it's much more than an e-manage ultimate on drugs.

The vi-pec v88 is a full standalone ecu that can control VTEC engagement, VTC and drive by wire. It also has 32x32 resolution mapping, traction control and a host of other features.

It makes the e-manage ultimate look like a toy. By the time you add a V-manage it'll cost you just as much for something with less features.

There are also plans to release a drive by wire module for the v44 so it can act as a full stand alone with drive by wire cars aswell.

There's no comparison in my opinion.

[aaronng]

No way, it's much more than an e-manage ultimate on drugs.

The vi-pec v88 is a full standalone ecu that can control VTEC engagement, VTC and drive by wire. It also has 32x32 resolution mapping, traction control and a host of other features.

It makes the e-manage ultimate look like a toy. By the time you add a V-manage it'll cost you just as much for something with less features.

There are also plans to release a drive by wire module for the v44 so it can act as a full stand alone with drive by wire cars aswell.

There's no comparison in my opinion.

I see, because it says "Also plugin ECU based on the V44 and V88 for Subaru, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Mazda and Toyota cars". Honda is not listed there. When will you trial it out?

[Chris_F]

I see, because it says "Also plugin ECU based on the V44 and V88 for Subaru, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Mazda and Toyota cars". Honda is not listed there. When will you trial it out?

There's actually a plugin listed on the site for the 92-95 eg civics and 96-99 Ek Civics aswell. And althought there's no plug-ins available for the K-series engined hondas I've confirmed with my local vi-pec dealer that the ecu is compatible with the K-series.

I actually dowloaded the Vi-Pec tuning software to confrim it too. It has options to choose VTEC solenoid outputs and you can configure Honda specific VTC outputs aswell.

The ECU will need to be wired into our cars though. The prices I quoted before actually include the cost of the ecu, wiring/installation and tuning. Drive in, drive out.

To get a similarly spec'd MOTEC ecu to work with the accord euro including the traction control and drive by wire features, you're looking at a minimum of $6k installed and tuned. In comparison, the Vi-Pec looks like a bargain.

[aaronng]

There's actually a plugin listed on the site for the 92-95 eg civics and 96-99 Ek Civics aswell. And althought there's no plug-ins available for the K-series engined hondas I've confirmed with my local vi-pec dealer that the ecu is compatible with the K-series.

I actually dowloaded the Vi-Pec tuning software to confrim it too. It has options to choose VTEC solenoid outputs and you can configure Honda specific VTC outputs aswell.

The ECU will need to be wired into our cars though. The prices I quoted before actually include the cost of the ecu, wiring/installation and tuning. Drive in, drive out.

To get a similarly spec'd MOTEC ecu to work with the accord euro including the traction control and drive by wire features, you're looking at a minimum of $6k installed and tuned. In comparison, the Vi-Pec looks like a bargain.

The B series (and also H and F) would be alright to use standalone ECUs as all the ECU does is to manage the engines. When it comes to the K and also the new R engines, the ECU does a bit more than just the engine, which is the reason why I suspect that it will be a piggyback solution for the Euro, rather than a case of swapping out the ECU with the VI-PEC. Even Hondata has conceded to that fact by offering a piggyback version of the Kpro using that 2nd ECU and patch harness.

[Chris_F]

The B series (and also H and F) would be alright to use standalone ECUs as all the ECU does is to manage the engines. When it comes to the K and also the new R engines, the ECU does a bit more than just the engine, which is the reason why I suspect that it will be a piggyback solution for the Euro, rather than a case of swapping out the ECU with the VI-PEC. Even Hondata has conceded to that fact by offering a piggyback version of the Kpro using that 2nd ECU and patch harness.

Even if the factory ECU does need to be retained with the vi-pec the factory ecu will have no input into any of the engine controls. In my eyes that means it's no longer a "piggy back" in the traditional sense. The same can be said for the hondata solution. You may be retaining the factory ecu but you'll be tuning the engine just like you would if you were using a standalone ecu. That's why I think a comparison to an e-manage ultimate is a bit miss leading. The ultimate does control some outputs independently from the factory ecu though and that's why it's the best piggyback solution available for the euro at the moment.

When your using a proper standalone ECU that maintains the factory ecu for non-engine related controls I'd say it's probably more accurate to call it a "paralell" setup and not a "piggy back". I'd hate to think that a Kpro or Vi-pec were given the same label as an apexi vafc... ew!

[Euro08Jaz]

rumors being circulated by marcus suggest that kpro will be at sema

the offending post:

Hondata an option finally!

We had spoken with an inside source and there is a dual ECU setup K-PRO going to be released for the TSX very shortly. It is being unveiled at SEMA.

The cost of an additional ECU, the harness, and the K-Pro means that is won't be an inexpensive option...but an option none-the less!


Marcus

your both on drugs

anyway what does this development mean for us? will i be able to use the comptech sc kit?

[aaronng]

When your using a proper standalone ECU that maintains the factory ecu for non-engine related controls I'd say it's probably more accurate to call it a "paralell" setup and not a "piggy back". I'd hate to think that a Kpro or Vi-pec were given the same label as an apexi vafc... ew!

I put the VAFC under the category of "interceptors", which are a POS in my opinion.

[Chris_F]

I put the VAFC under the category of "interceptors", which are a POS in my opinion.

Yea I agree. interceptors/piggy backs that simply alter the signal going into the factory ecu = POS.


A rank order of ecu's/flashes that work on the Acoord Euro (from worst to best if money is no object):

• Apexi VAFC
• Greddy E-manage blue
• Haltech Interceptor
• Greddy E-manage ultimate
• HKS F-con IS*
• Hondata Reflash*
• Greddy E-mange ultimate + Greddy V-manage
• HKS F-con V Pro*
• EFI Euro 1*
• EFI Euro 4*
• Vi-pec V88
• Motec m400 (fully optioned)

* = limited availability/difficult to aquire


Ecu's pending availability:

• Hondata dual ecu Kpro
• Vi-pec V44 (drive by wire module in development)

If anyone can think of any other ecu's or believes my rank order is wrong let me know and I'll keep it updated

[BusterSonic12]

what about emanage ulti + v manage? when i was overseas, i saw greddy f manage, anyone what that is?

[Chris_F]

what about emanage ulti + v manage? when i was overseas, i saw greddy f manage, anyone what that is?

list updated with v-manage

the f-manage is used to control the feedback loop to the factory ecu. All the documentation about it is in japanese so I don't know much more than that.

[EUR003act]

after dissing the greddy emanage for ages and not liking piggy back ecus...

i did alot of research on the greddy ultimate...

and i have changed my thinking... the greddy ultimate is not your typical piggyback ecu... it doesnt alter signals before they get to the ecu like traditional "interceptors"... but instead it sits between the ecus output and the car functions input... example:

Stock ECU --> GReddy Ultimate --> Injectors

by doing this, not only can you add or increase fuel/ignition, but you can retard...

and the stock ECU can not relearn because it doesnt know its doing any different!

in addition to this, features like being able to clamp or alter the MAP and throttle sensors, means the car can be forced to stay in open loop mode for complete control... or you could even add turbo/super charger without problems

with the addition of v-manage, you can control VTC... comparing Ultimate + Vmanage and K-Pro in terms of VTEC and VTC tinkering, they are both nearly identical in what they can do!

yes this ViPEC thing looks awesome, but if its a replacement ECU, it wouldnt be able to control the euros dash...