Lets Talk d-series

[Mikecivic78]

D16 should be 65-75 depending on mods/dyno.

B16a IMO 85-95. Below 80 I would be seriously asking questions.

On a proper (conservative dyno, not a US Disney one) dyno 77-80fwkw is normal and healthy stock b16a2. Anymore and the reading is false.

http://autospeed.com/cms/A_7484/article.html :In terms of peak power, the standard car previously generated 77kW ATW
There are other results ive seen for stock VtiRs and they are about the same, but carnt find on the internets atm

[dougie_504]

I disagree that you can lose approximately 40kw/33% from the drivetrain.

Have never ever seen a b16a pull that LOW without being sick. From the three dyno days I have been to, including Autosalon where you have plenty of comparison, the lowest yet healthy figure has been around 85kw and up to 100kw on the same dyno same day.

A friend made 78kw and then we found she was running on three cylinders.

Need compression results, otherwise 75-80kw is a very low reading dyno IMO.

[Bludger]

b16 fanboys v d15 fanboys.

no competition here bro'

[Mikecivic78]

I disagree that you can lose approximately 40kw/33% from the drivetrain.

Have never ever seen a b16a pull that LOW without being sick. From the three dyno days I have been to, including Autosalon where you have plenty of comparison, the lowest yet healthy figure has been around 85kw and up to 100kw on the same dyno same day.
A friend made 78kw and then we found she was running on three cylinders.

Need compression results, otherwise 75-80kw is a very low reading dyno IMO.

No offense, but I seriously doubt those cars were 100% stock and I strongly reckon a lot of dyno readings are crap. People love hearing high numbers way too much, and many dynos give the people what they want... ie; not the truth.

I trust Autospeed's dyno results, they are really no BS. Their runs are done on very low KM, 100% stock cars.

Apparently, my dead stock 01WRX would pull 103awkw (not counting torque) on a Dynodynamics awd dyno.

[dougie_504]

No offense, but I seriously doubt those cars were 100% stock and I strongly reckon a lot of dyno readings are crap. People love hearing high numbers way too much, and many dynos give the people what they want... ie; not the truth.

I trust Autospeed's dyno results, they are really no BS. Their runs are done on very low KM, 100% stock cars.

Apparently, my dead stock 01WRX would pull 103awkw (not counting torque) on a Dynodynamics awd dyno.

Not completely stock of course, but what B-series is?

Same day, same dyno, as a group:

ED9 with B18C7. SRI heat shielded, can't remember header, and 1.75" exhaust (for engineering) made 85.4kw (later made 108.5kw with exhaust and tuning).
EK with D16Y8, totally stock made 76kw
EF8 with SRI/H/E made 89kw
EF8 with CAI/H/E + head build (Skunk2 stage one, gears, ported/matched, valvetrain and untuned) made 100.7kw (later found to be losing compression in one cylinder).
EF8 with CAI/H/E made 99.4kw
EG2 with ITB's + full exhaust (and ?internals but would not disclose) made 108kw.
MR2 Spider with I/H/E made like 85kw also

So as you can see what had a fair few cars to compare, all healthy bar one, and a B18C7 running poorly. Which numbers are inflated and which are deflated?

Lowest B16A I ever saw was about 75-78kw at Autosalon, and we later found the plugs were rooted and one cylinder wasn't firing properly.

[Mikecivic78]

Not completely stock of course, but what B-series is?

Same day, same dyno, as a group:

Autospeed's results were achieved on a 100% stock car all the way down to stock intake resonator, as they do on most of their performance (before and after) write ups. Bog stock is 77-80kw and that's healthy. 33% drive train losses is on the money.

No one on that dyno day you mentioned had stock intake and headers, so of course they are pulling comfortably over the 77-80kw stock... add intake/header/exhaust and that will net an extra 15fwkw. With tune, I can see them pulling the high 90s.



BTW, the day you talk about, what dyno was it, and which shop?

[dougie_504]

The exact date I can't remember. About 25+ degC.

Dyno Dynamics dyno.
Fitzgerald Racing Services, Box Hill, VIC.
http://www.fitz-racing.com.au/

Of course you're welcome to criticise Dyno Dynamics, but would you comment on the results I have shown you? I'm not interested in stock resonators used by Autospeed. The car you referred to earlier (The EM1 turbo) clearly wasn't standard down to the resonator either.

I have given you pretty much a precise list of cars and exact mods/power figures delivered within a couple of hours of one another, so I'm very interested to see what you have to say. Of course you can't put a 10kw ATW difference down to a SRI/CAI or w/e.

The EF8 that made 99.4kw with I/H/E is my own, and I later found out that it was compression very well on all four cylinders at 215/210/215/220, which is why I believe I was making satisfactory power compared to some of my friends that day.

[Mikecivic78]

The exact date I can't remember. About 25+ degC.

Dyno Dynamics dyno.
Fitzgerald Racing Services, Box Hill, VIC.
http://www.fitz-racing.com.au/

Of course you're welcome to criticise Dyno Dynamics, but would you comment on the results I have shown you? I'm not interested in stock resonators used by Autospeed. The car you referred to earlier (The EM1 turbo) clearly wasn't standard down to the resonator either.

I have given you pretty much a precise list of cars and exact mods/power figures delivered within a couple of hours of one another, so I'm very interested to see what you have to say. Of course you can't put a 10kw ATW difference down to a SRI/CAI or w/e.

The EF8 that made 99.4kw with I/H/E is my own, and I later found out that it was compression very well on all four cylinders at 215/210/215/220, which is why I believe I was making satisfactory power compared to some of my friends that day.

On the contrary, I find Dyno Dynamics to be good. Where did I criticise it?

The article does state that the em1 was dynoed 100% stock. I have seen another article which had the same information about average stock ek4/em1 results which is where I got the numbers.

Doesn't the EF8 come with a JDM b16a? Doesn't that motor make an extra 7kw at the fly compared to EM1's B16a2?

[hitoriko]

no dyno is ever 100% accurate. So many different factors, fuel, engine condition, oils etc.... Even factory claims of HP figures arent always correct its used as an AVG figure.

and i would say that on AVG 80kw - 90kw on a healthy B16.

You can argue until your blue in the face but doesn't change the fact that no dyno will give you an exact figure

[trism]

I've said it once and I'll say it again, dynos are only good for tuning purposes, or for comparing same day same car, before and after results for mods.

Comparing different cars on different dynos at different times is pointless.

[dougie_504]

On the contrary, I find Dyno Dynamics to be good. Where did I criticise it?

The article does state that the em1 was dynoed 100% stock. I have seen another article which had the same information about average stock ek4/em1 results which is where I got the numbers.

Doesn't the EF8 come with a JDM b16a? Doesn't that motor make an extra 7kw at the fly compared to EM1's B16a2?

Never said you did, just saying you're welcome to attribute some of the figures to the dyno.

What I really wanted we're your thoughts on those figures given they are all from the same day/dyno. And funnily enough every single person had 15" rims, varying from re001 to t1r etc.

JDM b16a (first gen) is 118kw. 7kw more would be the b18c2.

[_CRX_]

A whole page of sh1t that has nothing to do with d series.....good work